toddy, Wolf, Fernando - All of your above posts definately bring this topic into the realm of Spain - and something that I don't think MM finds out of place. The topic might not be something that a casual visitor to Spain would be interested in - but as far as having relevance to Spain and being something that those of us who return again and again to Spain we find it a topic of great interest. The sharing of insights and understanding shown by the board memebrs on this and numerous other 'controversial' topics has added to the knowledge of so many of us from so many countries. I for one, say mucho gracias!

At the risk of sounding pedantic again, I'm inclined to agree that Americans do tend to see people as good or bad. That's the pragmatist in us. Remember that we are a nation of immigrants. We (mostly) left european nations behind because we were unhappy withsome facet of life there. Most of my ancestors were from Galicia (Se acceptan chistes sobre gallegos)and the Canary Islands, and left after 1850. The US is less than 400 years old, and a lot of families have been here less than half that.

I think that what is different about the islamic terrorists (and what I think many Americans see)is that (a)they use religion as a tool to eliminate people they don't like, (b)they keep their people in ignorance, and (c)in spite of what they say, they seem very intent on taking over the world. Palestine and Israael are in the news more, but how do you reconcile Islamic actions in Indonesia and the Phillipines?

I hope Spain never incurs the wrath of islamic terrorists, and if it doesn't, I for one will never believe it was because of sucessful
"talking."

Ernesto

The United States of America is 226 years old.

And Spain was occupied by Muslims and was the focal point of Muslim civilization for 700-years!

Among all the western European nations, Spain may have the best relationship/rapport with the Arab world. Maybe that's why 3-suspected highly placed Al Qaeda operatives (terrorists?) have been 'detained' by Spanish Police during the past 2-weeks. They thought they had a safe refuge in Spain??

Miguelito,

The proposal by the Saudi King has been made before. This gesture, although valid, is not the same as trying to settle the issues as an active participant.

Ernesto (ebetancourt) is stirking the nail on the head with his description of Islamic terrorists. These are just a bunch of murderers using religion as a shield.

Here is some more food for thought. If the Palestinians are freedom fighters, why hide inside the curch of the Nativity? Again, this is another propaganda scheme on their behalf, and again they are endagering the lives of non participants, the Franciscans inside the church.

As for Bin Laden riding in the plains of Spain, I do not see this happening. The Spaniards drove the Muslims out of Spain and I don't think they want these guys back. When I visited Cordoba in 1992, and if my memory serves me right, it appeared to me that "el mesquito" had been conviniently converted to a church.

As far as I know islamic countries in general are not the best examples of how to run a country in a democracy which respects the Human Rights, that is more than true. Palestina is not an exception, that is true (for example they have executed disidents without a court). However, that is not an argument for what Israel is doing there.

I agree with you all, using religion as an excuse is always a big, big error. And the fact that Palestinians use it to make young people to inmolate themselves is repugnant. They also do it because they know that jews value to have the entire corpse when they are buried. They blast israelis to make they bodies pieces, it is doubly cruel.

As for converting a Mezquita to a church I think it is true. In medieval times churches were converted to mezquitas and viceverse. However, it was not really done as an act of humiliation as you may think. As far as I know it has a practical reason (the romanic churches had towers used as minaretes for the mezquitas, and chirstians and moslems respected the temples as sacred places even if they didn't were of their own religion).

As for arabs conquering the south of Spain as if this was an antique movie... Let's allow Ben Laden build his own psicotic fantasies.

It is true that at least 20 Al-Qaeda members (including 2 specially important) have been detained and jailed. It appears that Al-Qaeda had/has it's financial structure here. What a shame

Spain is not a refuge of terrorists, though it is true that some very rich criminals (weapon traficants, rusian mafia, etc) have been hiding in the Costa del Sol, the same way the rich europeans buy properties there and have their retirement. It was very easy for them to hide.

You may be sure of one thing: The public support for these kind of people in Spain is 0%. Is a shame for us to have this people along with us, and thinking that from our country they have managed to kill people.

Fernando

Roe, you are absolutely correct, I was mentally counting "colony" time.

Ernesto