No Asterault...it's Schoolhouse Rock... My personal choice in the Time-Life music series is "Metal Ballads", though. Aaah, nothing like the soothing sounds of Winger and Mr. Big. Pass the studded wristbands, please.

Helloooo to you, too, Wendy. Yes, it is revisionist crap. I meant no offense by it. By the way, the Stanford-9 battery tests kids on their knowledge of nutty refrains from history. Did you go to "la prepa" in California? :p

It's a good thing that all of those woes were concentrated in what is today the United States and Canada. Who knows what would've happened if Admiral Syphilis and the Amazing Christian Elitists would've been able to extend their vise-like grip south to Mesoamerica and the South American continent. Centuries of civil war and hatred? Governments dependent on the drug trade? The Amazing Collapsible Economy? Widespread corruption? Indigenous groups of people slaughtered and enslaved? I shudder at the thought.

BTW [that's "by the way" Fernando ], what is this "roots of white, Christian superiority"? Down here all I see is "brown pride" and multicolor brush art painting on the sides of vans showing an Incredible Hulk-esque "Aztec warrior" with his curvaceous and voluptuous "Aztec maiden" at his side. If that's not revision I don't know what is.

P.S. The poor, helpless, "victims of cultural elitism" enjoyed sacrificing humans to the rocks they worshipped. They also enjoyed a priestly class of "supernaturals" who ran the entire show...whether you were Aztec, Maya or Inca...Mexica, Chichimeca, whatever...your boss was the cleric. If you subscribe to the white, Christian superiority myth, one can always just say that their preachers were simply replaced.

Sincerely,
Chac Mool

P.p.s. Please stop sacrificing people to me. I'm a stone statue for crying out loud.

"Metal Ballads" - i can just see the metal mullets with their fishnet and makeup, his and hers makeup, that is, having a romantic stroll alongst the ocean, hand in hand.

'just let me rock!' - saxon

Love,
Yngwe Malmstein

pd> 'white elitism?' sounds like envy to me... i couldn't care less what color someone is, but oh i guess that's just because i'm white. sorry, but you revisionist PC'ers are the ones who are racist. does it matter that i have jewish roots? probably not. the jews are not a race, even tho originally they may have been.

P.C. historical revisionism suffers from epistemological arrogance, that's why it fails to convince!

This search for 20th century definition of perfectionism in our historical figures is bizarre. Blaming Columbus for being a man of his time is ludicrous.

I guess there's no soup for me!

Booklady,

Hell! You not only get soup, I'll buy it! We'll get it from the "Soup Nazi" in NYC. What'cha think?

Wolf (Hoping he's not too "politically incorrect.")

Wolf, Thank you for the invitation, I would love to go to NYC, anytime! I love NYC! BTW does the Soup Nazi really exist, or is he a Seinfeld creation?

I have been reading all these posts with great interest...maintaining my aquarian diplomacy and not jumping on either bandwagon (the brown revisionists or the white elitists) as I would have to jump on both and would fall in the middle on the road of division. Did that make sense to you?

The most interesting of all this is the revisionist perspective and how many Latin Americans (gosh I hope that was politically correct) want to preserve their cultural heritage. Kudos to you!

My parents were just here visiting Spain for a month. It was fascinating listening to my father point out so many of the parallels between the Spanish culture and his native Filipino culture (which I know sadly little about). What left me with my jaw adrop was when I asked my father about the Filipino culture PRIOR to Spain´s occupancy. His response? The Philippines counts its history from the point of Spain´s occupancy, not before. To me, that is sad. I would bet my bottom Euro that the Philippines, with its indigenous people, the Malay, the Tasaday, etc., have a very rich and fascinating history.

It is also sad that there isn´t more done to educate America´s children on the history of "The Americas" before the arrival of the Nina, Pinta, Santa Maria, Columbus, the Mayflower and the hoards of Anglo Saxons to follow. Granted, at that point it wasn´t America, but it wasn´t either upon Columbus´ arrival. Our public education of the indigenous inhabitants of the Americas (called Indians only because Columbus thought he was in India) extends little beyond tomahawks and feathers, the Sioux and the Apache.

Oh I´m sorry, this thread is about the validity of Christopher Columbus, not world history (one is the continuation of another my friends).

Well, to some he is a villan to others he is a hero (in my hometown of Phildelphia, he is a hero...has a major street named after him, a bank holiday, a parade, a monument and a huge Italian community to boot). That is usually the case with any public figure. One has to look no further than George W. Bush, or sadly, ETA. (uh-oh, did I open a can or worms or what?? :p )

Personally, I think Columbus came from the Philippines before they were the Philippines (named for Spanish King Felipe of course) and his real name was Columbusay. Or maybe he is an ancestor of Rocky...or maybe...

P.S. I just re-read the chorrada of my post and bust out laughing and thought "oh God, what a bunch of mumbo jumbo". Oh well, at least I expressed my 2 centimos worth.

Chica,

Your point is well put in reference to native history in the Phillipines, as well as the Americas. The problem is that the people who have to maintain the history of the past are ones who are descended from these people. If they don't maintain a record of it, and allow it to die, there isn't much anyone can do to preserve it.

But one need look only further than their own family to see how little we actually know about our own ancestors. Millions of people spend endless hours tracing their heritage - their families - through time. We usually know so little about them beyond grandparents. If we don't maintain our own gealogical trees, and can't take care of our own history as a family, why should we say that anyone that doesn't do it for another is an elitist?

My wife and I are both part Indian. As such, we are proud of it, but since the history of Native Americans is so sketchy, because the history was basically passed down through tales around a campfire, it would be wrong for us to blame the European enclave for our own loss. We have to shoulder the responsibility ourselves, for failing to document it properly, so it can be included in the total history of North America. It wasn't up to Columbus, or Peter Stuyvesant, to sit around a campfire and discuss it, and put it in writing. It was up to the Indians.

What concerns me most about revisionist history is that it doesn't seem to be an attempt to add historical facts. The whole intent seems to be more intent on destroying that which has been recorded. If a person doesn't agree with that perspective, you are automatically labeled an Elitist. I totally disagree with that view, and since I do, I'm automatically an elitist.

Interesting isn't it? If you don't agree with me, you're the enemy? If I'm the enemy, why should I give a damn about you and your history? A sad state of affairs, but that's where we stand today. Let's hope people quit throwing rocks at each other, and try to "add" history to our various cultures. We don't have to "destroy" one to make room for our own.

Wolf

That street will always be Delaware Ave, Columbus Blvd. doesn't stick...

yeah Asterault! Tell that to all the Italian-American business leaders in Philadelphia. You know, the ones whose names are forever immortalized in that unusual monument to Christopher Columbus on Penn´s Landing.

Ahh William Penn....another interesting character in America´s history.

Booklady,

Yes, the Soup Nazi is real, although he don't like being called that. http://home.earthlink.net/~asena/soup.html

As most New Yorkers who have bought his soup will attest, he's a jerk on a good day, but his soups are to die for.

Of course he gained popularity from Seinfeld. In fact, just by entering "soup nazi" in your browser, you can find knock-offs of his famous recipes. They ain't half bad, although most New Yorkers will tell you there's something missing. My guess is - his warm personality -

He has a great gezpacho when it's available. Someone told me it's a cross between Spanish & South American. Waiting in a line that stretches down the block and around the corner is quite normal for his little place. It's amazing at how successful he is. It proves that even jerks can make a good buck if they have something great to offer.

Wolf