I agree with churrocaliente and vieve, to a large extent--I teach undergrads at two institutions, a large public university and a small liberal arts Lutheran college. In both places, many of my students are interested in doing the minimum that they need to do to get through the course. This leads, oftentimes, to an antagonistic relationship between instructor and student. I have had students ask whether they need to attend at all, and have even had a student come up to me in April (the course started in January) and ask who the instructor for the class was.

I require attendance in my courses, but am still flooded with excuses, from illness (legit) to having to work during ALL regular posted class times (then why did you sign up for my course?). It's really hard for a teacher who loves to teach to keep up her enthusiasm in the face of students who don't want to meet her halfway.

Part of the problem here is that our students are overextended...many, many of them work part-time or even full-time, and many don't get sufficient rest. They are frequently ill, too. I think some of that has to do with having become accustomed to a particular standard of living (from being at home with mom and dad, and perhaps even having additional income from a part-time job in high school) and not wanting to give it up.

I believe that they are busy and stressed, but I don't believe that they all need cars (we live in a town with very good public transit), fancy clothes, or their own apartment (with no roommates). It's hard for them to economize, though, because they see the culture going on around them and want to be part of it.

As for participation in and dedication to classes, I see that as partly the fault of the instructors and partly (probably mostly) the fault of the students. When I require attendance, my students do come, and do pay attention, and do learn. I have to force them to be there, but they (or many of them) WILL try once you get them past their desire to sleep in or work! Too many college teachers just stand at the front of the room and lecture in a monotone, then expect their students to be excited to learn! I try to teach to a variety of learning styles, using methods including lecture, discussion, group projects, in-class writing, etc.

Grades are another matter--students expect good grades for very little effort. A "C" is not average in any class nowadays--students think a "C" is a death sentence.

This may be different from in Spain, where it seems like less of a problem to fail the occasional exam. From what I have seen, students take failing a test as an indication that they need to study harder, not that there is something wrong with the test.

I could go on...but just to clarify what I meant above, it wasn't that American children are totally independent and not spoiled (because they are quite dependent and spoiled), but that there are other forces at work, like wanting children to be able to soothe themselves to sleep and wanting the marriage bed back for the couple's intimacy, not for nursing babies.

Very interesting topic.

Two things come to mind, vast numbers of high school grads in US go to college as far as possible from home, and vast amount of spanish students live home, and esp. young men can live home in to their late 20s early 30s, or until they get married.

I see somewhat of a contradiction with this and some of the earlier messages.

Zzuess-it's true, many college students in the U.S. leave home to go to college. However, college dorms are basically filled with kids losing their minds over their newfound independence(partying,binge-drinking,etc). Could be they're running screaming from their stifling womblike homes?
I've had the same experience in college as vieve. So many kids more intent on frat parties than their education.

I'm a middle school teacher now and this whole not taking responsibility thing is equally rampant in public schools and i think has less to do with class as it does just the whole American philosophy that seems so popular: blame someone else. I'd like to think at times that it's just the age group. They're kids, maybe they're still learning how to become responsible? But looking at alot of they adults they have as examples I'm less hopeful.
As vieve said, "i don't mean to stomp on my home... but there are some things that just don't always add up... and it shouldn't be bad to say so, right?" It' never bad to call something for what it is. It gives us the chance to improve it(I am an eternal optimist )

As far as Spanish boys living at home longer, they probably have a healthier relationships with their families which allow them to grow up to be their own independent persons instead of the constant domineering hovering that parents here in the states tend to do. I know in my family (we're Hispanic) none of us left the house before age 21 and yet we're all very independent. What at times seems a contradiction could actually make the most sense?

Oh and back to the topic! My sisters and myself slept with our mom as babies and when my sister had her son, he slept with her too. I think this may be more common in Mexican families in the U.S.?

What an interesting topic this one have become!
And how wrong I was, I had the idea than High School was easier in USA than in Spain, because lots of Spanish study a year there, but I thought that University was something really serious and harder than here, maybe because of places like Harvard, and although I have watched some films about colleges with toga parties and so on, I didn't give them credit, I thaught that almost of the people don't go to University and those who go study really hard.
About Spain I think we're going to something more similar to USA, each time students have to work less. When I went to University 8 years ago, the teacher didn't care too much if we attended the classes or not, but we knew that it was better for us to go if we wanted to pass the exams. The problem was when the teacher was not good enough and you thought that you would use better your time studying in the library or having a rest on the grass or in the cafeteria.
Although I was responsable for my studies and I passed very well almost of the subjects I know I could have done more, but there was a mix of conformism and desmotivation in my case. Probably was caused by the overcrowded classes and the desmotivation of the teachers, and my own way of being.

Now there is a great debate in Spanish education as the government is trying to change things.
There has been a new law for university and now they are talking about a new one for rising the quality in school and High School. I don't now them deeply, and it's not easy to think what is better, but I think that now basic education is really bad. What they are talking about is separate students in good students and bad students so this is very polemic.

As far as it comes to healthier relationships, sons/mothers-fathers etc , living at home longer,
it is quite subjective.
In many cases it cultivates dependency, difficulty in dealing with lifes ups and downs later on in life and maybe the biggest down side I see is the confusion young spanish man has as to whom he marries, his mother or somebody else, symbolicly speaking of course.

Authoritative mind set re womans place and role at home or in the society as a whole is not helped when independce of a young person , a man , is tied up too much in mothers acceptance of her place, and the daily reminder of fathers dominance in a relationship.

I think many people see what they WANT to see , when it comes to comparisons between various countries, ex spain/ US , family life, school, values etc.

Of course everyone has their own experiences and reasons to see these things their own way, but it does not mean one is better than other.