Hello,

Does anyone know the origin of castellano? I know it comes from Latin, but did it mix with something else to form? Did it just evolve naturally with no mixing?

OK, here's the short version (which is all I'm capable of giving, lol!):

vulgate Latin (i.e., a "people's" version) was used in Spain in the early centuries, even after the Roman Empire lost its force. Then comes the 8th and 9th centuries when Arabic peoples and culture spread across Spain. Arab had a very strong influence on Spanish.

Then, of course, jump to 1492 and international colonialism. The indigenous languages (different by region, by country, etc.) also influenced the Spanish with which they came into contact. Slowly but surely, these changes made their way back to the mother country.

How's that for short and sweet?
picara

I remember someone gave a very thorough answer to this question (or one very similar) in another thread somewhere. Ring a bell, anyone?

The language come from latin. The rest of languages just increase the vocabulary. The main language after latin increasing our vocabulary is arabic, many words about the new technologies and products they brought and many others (I think this is the topic we talked about long time ago).
Then some words come mainly from german, greek, french, native american languages and english (in these days, lots of them)

El Boqueron, I think that I was the one who posted it

Anyway, since this is a fascinating topic, and I have finished my exams, I will write it again.

All what I'm going to write is the way I think it is, the way I have been taught, and the way I have readen it was. It could be more or less accurate.

The Iberian Peninsula was populated by different realms and cultures before it was colonized by ancient civilizations.

The natives were the Celts (which had their influence more strongly in the north of the Peninsula, and also in Ireland), the Ibers (I mean íberos) which were even native or paneuropeans, and Tartessos (a extinct culture which is said to be settled somewhere in the south, perhaps in the Cadiz province). All these cultures merged with years into a "common" one called celtibers (celtíberos).

Then we had migratory fluxes coming to the Peninsula, with phoenicians (fenicios), greeks and cartagonians (is that the word? I mean cartagineses) founding sea-ports along all the mediterranean coasts of the Peninsula. From that times we still have some towns: Cádiz (which was given various names by the phoenicians, the greeks and the cartagineses, Gadir, Gadis, Gador, ...), Cartagena (Cartago Nova), Sagunto, etc

The cartagineses and Anibal had conquered and colonized the southeastern half of the Peninsula, but they were a threat to the romans, who decided to conquer the Peninsula. They called it Hispania, or hispanic provinces, and divided it into different subprovinces (whose borders changed at the same time the Roman Empire did): Lusitania, Tarraconensis and Betica.

The romans left here countless cities, monuments, and a precious treasure: the common lathyn. Hispania also gave to the empire some emperors, as Trajano and Adriano.

Some cities founded by the romans are: Tarragona (Tarraco), Barcelona (Barcino), Zaragoza (Caesar Augusta), Ciudad Rodrigo (Mirobriga), Mérida (Emérita Augusta), Sevilla (Hispalis),...

At the fifth century a.C. the Roman Empire was overrun by the goths, which were germanic tribes with much less culture than the romans. The Peninsula received migratory fluxes of theses tribes: Suevos (Northwest), Alanos, Vándalos, Bereberes and Visigoths (which were the most numerous). The common lathyn evolved acquiring germanic words (guerra, bizarro, brigada,...). The visigoths, as the previous cultures, mixed with the natives.

Then the arabs came (in 711 a.C.), and conquered almost all the Peninsula, except for the northern regions (Asturias, Cantabria, País Vasco). Keep in mind that the arabs were only about 100000, and the natives were a handful millions. But the arabs culture was superior than the one of the natives, and thus, Spain was arabized. The common lathyng evolved taking lots of words from the arab (words like alguacil, almohada, agua, acequia,...).

For some centuries the arabs remained here, but were defeated by CarloMagno in Poitiers, so they didn't cross the Pyrenees. Some other muslims came to the Peninsula: sudaneses, northafricans,...

The it started "La Reconquista", and the birth of modern spanish languages. The unconquered north natives started to push south the arabs. From west to east these were the kingdoms that existed:
Astures, Leoneses, Castellanos (which were firstly a basque county between the current Cantabria and País Basco), navarros, aragoneses y catalanes (which were aragonese counties, but I include them because they kept their language).

All these kingdoms had their own language, evolved from the common lathyn, and thus similiar to the others. The basques conserved their own non-lathyn language. It is said they did it because, as mountaineous as it is the Basque Country, the romans couldn't influence them, or didn't conquered them at all. What it seems true is that the basque come from some place in what is today the Caucasus.

The christian kingdoms begun to conquer the arab caliphate of Cordoba. For centuries, the christian kingdoms continued to conquer de south territories, and the languages evolved. At the west, the gallego-portuges remained as a language, but the astur and the leonese merged in one language. Then it was the castellano in the center, and in the east the navarro and the aragonese also merged. Catalonian remained also as a language, spreading through Valencia and the Balearic Islands.

In 1492 there were only 4 realms remaining: Portugal (which was formed from a castlilian county) with its own language, the castilian language had merged, overrun its side-languages: the astur-leones, and the navarro-aragones, the Castilian Kingdom had also merged with these realms. The Aragon Kingdom remained with the aragonese and the catalonian as its languages.

In the same year lots of important things happend:
The "Catholic Kings" Isabel from Castilla and Fernando from Aragon had married and signed an alliance.
Colon discovered America, which was left to colonize for castlilian natives (that is the reason the castilian is spoken there, and not the aragonese-catalonian), the aragoneses colonized Cerdeña, Sicilia and Napoles (they were given in exclusivity the Mediterranean).
In 1493 Navarra was anexioned by force by the Castilian Kingdom.
In 1492 the last moslem kingdom (Granada) was conquered by united forces of castilians and aragoneses.
In 1492 the spanish jews were made to abandon Spain. They still conserve their own arcaic castilian, called sefardí.
In 1493 the spanish moslems were made to abandon Spain.
Spain gained religious unity by loosing her best agricultors and comerciants.
In 1492 the Canarian Islands were colinized, then in 1493 the cities of Ceuta and Melilla were founded, and other forts were occupied (Orán, Tanger, Túnez,...).

The realms united when Carlos I inherited them. He was the most powerful king ever, being king of Catilla, Aragón, Navarra, Napoles y las Dos Sicilias, Netherlands and all the american territories, Philipines and the Germanic Empire.

His son Felipe II also inherited the throne of Portugal.

All these realms had their influence in the spanish languages.

In the last centuries other cultures influenced the remaining languages (french, english, native american-indians, italian,...).

And that is the history. Now you now why in Galicia the galego is spoken, why in Portugal the portuguese is spoken, why the bable (a castilian dialect with most conexions with the ancient astur-leonés), the basque, the castilian and all its dialects, the catalonian and all its dialects, and every local dialect all around Spain

I'm really proud of this richness, and all the influences the spanish languages have had throught their history.

Fernando

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaawwnnnnn....does anyone have a Vivarin? (or should I say "¿tiene alguien un Vivarín?")

heavens. sólo sé que no sé nada... and when it rains, it pours!

Thanks Fernando!

Hola Mikerod76,
By the way Fernando, that was an excellent and thorough summary of tracing the linguistic roots of modern Spanish.

Modern Castillian or "Castellano" originated in Castilla, the Central Region of Spain. After the unification of Spain in 1492, Castellano naturally emerged as the "official" language of Spain because it was recognized that a central language was necessary for the easy communication among the different regions, and the new American territories . It is notable that among the events taking place in 1492 was the order by their Catholic Majesties, Ferdinand and Isabella, to develop a common grammar. So in 1492 Elio Antonio de Nebrija, wrote the first grammar of Castellano. Castillian was officially declared the language of Spain by Philip V in 1714.

If you are interested here is an authoritative website that will provide many links to the history and development of Castillian. History and Dialectology of Spanish

Jo Fernando, menudo repasito de la historia de España que te acabas de marcar!

The most curious thing I found out recently is that, due to the fact that Sicily, Sardinia and Southern Italy once belonged to Spain, Catalan is spoken in the north-west of Sardinia (in the Alghero region) and the regional dialect of those places is closer to Spanish (i.e. they say verano instead of estate).

In few words, Castilian language is the latin language spoken by Basque people.The base of the language is Latin and other classic languages (about 96% of vocabulary), but the substrate of the language is mainly the Basque language.Every laguage has a substrate that determinates basically the sound and the evolution of the words, and Spanish laguage was born in the limits of Castile, La Rioja and the province of Alava, and in this area the people spoke mainly in Basque.There are other substrates in Spanish language, mostly the Celtic laguages of Northern Spain, the Iberian laguage and the Greek language, but they are not so determinating like Basque language.

I really don´t think that basque had such on influence on castellano. I am no expert, but they are very different and I can´t imagine what could have been changed.

The Basques were one of the first people to speak Old Spanish/Early Castellano. During the early days of the Christian Reconquest, large numbers of Catholic Basques moved to Castilla-La Vieja in order to fight WITH the inhabitants against the Islamic invasions. Many Basques denounced their language and culture over a few generations and became Early Castellanos. Because of this, their accent influenced Early Spanish. For example: Fabulare>Fablar>Hablar; fel>fiel>hiel. The "f" sound became aspirated except before "ue" and "r". The Basque language at that time (and probably today) didn't have the sound "f" in its language. And like the Basque language, the Old Spanish accent and language sounded bizzare, coarse, and most of all STRONG, to the ears of their neighbors in León and Aragón. The Old Spanish accent, later on in the middle of the 13th century, became replaced when Alfonso X (El Sabio/The Learned) adopted the New or "Toledan" Castellano as the new standard of spoken "Spanish".

El Cid: Could you quote your source on the last post there? I'd be interested in taking a look at it...

"An Anthology of Old Spanish" by Tatiana Fotitch, PH D. The Catholic University of America Press Washington, D.C 1969
(This book shows texts in the stages of Spanish Language evolution)

"From Latin to Spanish" (I read this book around a year ago...this book explained the history of sound changes from Vulgar Latin to Old Spanish to Modern Spanish. It talked about the how the Basque emmigration to Castilla caused the aspiration of the Old Spanish "f" sound towards the silent "h" sound over a period of time...this change didn't occur overnight, but in a matter of centuries...something I forgot to mention in my previous post. :o As for the publication of the book and author...don't expect me to remember the date and name, it's beyond my memory now. )

I'm sorry I dimmed your hopes of me giving you an internet source, because there isn't one. The internet is not a reliable source compared to books. Make sure you listen to Basque speech in the near future...you'll see what I mean, different and unique in it's own right. And if you're wondering, I don't hate the Basque language. I respect the language(s) of my ancestors.

Hasta luego,

El Cid

PS: Euskera does have a strong accent. An accent unlike other accents on Earth but surprisenly close to Spanish.

FYI,

all the study i've done (or been forced to do) in spanish linguistics indicates that most of the evolution of words in Castillian stems from Latin as opposed to Vasco. i would not doubt that some influence would have to come from nearby and other influential languages, like Arabic (lending harsh gutteral 'j' and soft 'g'), as well as other phonyms and words. but i have never heard of any direct relation to Vasco being an influence -- just so you know, i'm not doubting it.

i know this sounds elementary to many of you, but i am addressing specifically El Cid's post regarding the evolution of F to H.

Latin/Italian to Castillian:
Fare >> Hacer
Farina >> Harina
Fumo >> Humo
Figo >> Higo

as well the expansion of vowels from Latin:
portam >> puerta
focum >> fuego (o > ue, and c > g)
osum >> hueso (silent 'h', and o > ue)
ceacum >> ciego (e > ie, and c > g)
masc. -um >> -o
fem. -am >> -a (altho some -am's were masculine, which explains why 'mapa' is masc. 'el mapa')

a good example of this is Italian versus Castillian, where Italian has kept much more of the original spelling of Latin than Castillian has. you can see examples of this in the other romance languages (esp. Catalan) too.

i'll edit this post later with my source, for those interested, as i don't have it with me now...

andrew
:wq

pd> here's one the sources i wanted to offer:
'introducción a linguística española' by milton azevedo

Umm, as far as I know, castilian came from the common lathyn (not the most cultural one spoked by the roman citizens, but the one spoked by the most of the inhabitants of the Iberian Peninsula) and its origin is located in the west of the Basque Country, between it and Cantabria (in fact in a basque county). Not any single language in Spain is free of influence from the others, and it is sure that the basque language and castilian have been influencing each other for centuries, due to the proximity and the comercial, migratory and culture fluxes. Realize that in the Basque Country 90% or more of the people speak castilian, and a great number also speak basque or one of its dialects. This has happened for centuries, so words and phonemas have been exported to the other language.

For example: In basque the word window "ventana" didn't exist, and it was imported from castilian as "ventanua" (transformed to comply with the grammar). I can't recall any basque word in castilian, but there are surely hundreds...

Fernando

There's only one Spanish word that I know of, so far, that comes from Basque: "Izquierdo". However, I'm either unaware of other Basque load-words into Spanish or I just read them in the past and automatically accepted them as genuine Spanish words. :p

PS: Curse words need not apply. :o

My wife's family insists it originated mostly from the Burgos region. Is that true orrrrrrr can I call mi suegra a BIG FAT LIAR! (Please please, the second, just joking suegra)

real_megia: I feel your pain on the linguistic studies...back in my university days I did the same.

I remember the "hacer" evolution as having a few more steps: fare > fadzer > façer > facer > hacer. This is not uncommon in the evolution of castellano, though.

As far as the "ventanua" example, there are a thousand different words in euskera that have been "borrowed" from castellano. The common thread that many of them have is that they are words that represent somewhat "modern" concepts/items (such as "nuklearik" for "nuclear"). Good example and good point, Fernando.

HOLA!

I love that we've got linguistic conversation! that's definitely my area of interest. This year I took a course about the history of the language, and I have some great references for all you aspiring linguists out there, or for anyone who's curious.

My fave is Ralph Penny, I've used 2 of his books in 2 different classes, and they are VERY useful. Both have great appendices if you're searching for the evolution of specific sounds or words, etc. Here's the one about history of the language (and there is a version española as well)

'A History of the Spanish Language' by Ralph Penny, 1991

there's also a great one by Paul Lloyd, but I found it a little harder to follow than Penny.

'From Latin to Spanish', 1987. it's also a great reference, and has a version española.

then, the mother of all : COROMINAS. This is an etymological diccionary, and has the history and evolution of a bizillion words. I used this for several papers, it's amazing. there's also a brief version.

'Diccionario etimologico castellano e hispanico', by Joan Corominas, 1980. this book is incredible! but it's not just a book, it's volumes of books.

I would totally recommend taking a history of the language class to anyone who is interested in Linguistics. you will learn more than you can ever imagine! I had a great Prof at PSU.

I love that people are pumped about linguistics!
take care!

HOLA!

I love that we've got linguistic conversation! that's definitely my area of interest. This year I took a course about the history of the language, and I have some great references for all you aspiring linguists out there, or for anyone who's curious.

My fave is Ralph Penny, I've used 2 of his books in 2 different classes, and they are VERY useful. Both have great appendices if you're searching for the evolution of specific sounds or words, etc. Here's the one about history of the language (and there is a version española as well)

'A History of the Spanish Language' by Ralph Penny, 1991

there's also a great one by Paul Lloyd, but I found it a little harder to follow than Penny.

'From Latin to Spanish', 1987. it's also a great reference, and has a version española.

then, the mother of all : COROMINAS. This is an etymological diccionary, and has the history and evolution of a bizillion words. I used this for several papers, it's amazing. there's also a brief version.

'Diccionario etimologico castellano e hispanico', by Joan Corominas, 1980. this book is incredible! but it's not just a book, it's volumes of books.

I would totally recommend taking a history of the language class to anyone who is interested in Linguistics. you will learn more than you can ever imagine! I had a great Prof at PSU.

I love that people are pumped about linguistics!
take care!

HOLA!

I love that we've got linguistic conversation! that's definitely my area of interest. This year I took a course about the history of the language, and I have some great references for all you aspiring linguists out there, or for anyone who's curious.

My fave is Ralph Penny, I've used 2 of his books in 2 different classes, and they are VERY useful. Both have great appendices if you're searching for the evolution of specific sounds or words, etc. Here's the one about history of the language (and there is a version española as well)

'A History of the Spanish Language' by Ralph Penny, 1991

there's also a great one by Paul Lloyd, but I found it a little harder to follow than Penny.

'From Latin to Spanish', 1987. it's also a great reference, and has a version española.

then, the mother of all : COROMINAS. This is an etymological diccionary, and has the history and evolution of a bizillion words. I used this for several papers, it's amazing. there's also a brief version.

'Diccionario etimologico castellano e hispanico', by Joan Corominas, 1980. this book is incredible! but it's not just a book, it's volumes of books.

I would totally recommend taking a history of the language class to anyone who is interested in Linguistics. you will learn more than you can ever imagine! I had a great Prof at PSU.

I love that people are pumped about linguistics!
take care!

...and I'm pumped about someone who is so excited the "enter" key gets hit three times! I haven't seen that much excitement over linguistics since Noam Chomsky and his pet ape Nim Chimpsky!

I hate to insert an Iowa joke here, being from Minnesota and all...

Thank you thank you thank you for the information!

CaliBasco [Who enjoys ribbing a neighbor to the south whenever possible...]

Thx Cali

I'm not a linguist, and I may be wrong, after all, all what I know about the history of the spanish language I learnt in the school...

Fernando

Here's an interesting twist. The Old Spanish (cedilla) "ç" and the Old Spanish "z", were pronounced as ,(ts)=ç, and (dz)=z. These stops became confused over the centuries and eventually changed into the Modern Spanish lisp that some of us here use when speaking Spanish.

Here are the examples of pronounciation. I'll organize the examples shown below, so you'd all can have a more clearer understanding of how certain Old Spanish words were pronounced in the past. (For those who aren't linguistically inclined. )

Palatal Voiceless Stops (ts)

[OS]Coraçon: (Cor-at-son)
[OS]Consolaçion: (Con-so-lat-sion)

Palatal Voiced Stops (dz)

[OS]Lazrar: (Lad-z-rar)
[OS]Vazio: (Vad-zio)

There goes my two cents... :p

I swear I didn't mean to make my reply post 3 times!!!!!!!!!!

sorry to take up space, jajaja!

That's what they all say...and we believe you too! :p

I was rereading this great thread and thought I might add a nice link in Spanish about the history of the language, Camino de la lengua . Just as Fernando has written this page suggests that "se habla castellano en su estado más puro" in Valladolid. I am biased, but I would have to recommmend to any student of the language that they consider the capital of Castilla y León as a destination.

Agua from latin Aqua, (not from arabic)

El árabe no ha sido una lengua de substrato con respecto al castellano sino que básicamente influyó en el léxico [2200 palabras] ; en el sufijo -í para formar adjetivos y gentilicios ; marroquí , andalusí ... y en la pronunciación de la S- inicial latina en J-.

Succus > Xugo > Jugo

En cuanto a los artículos el la todas las fuentes que he consultado los hacen proceder del latín "ille" "illa"

Castellano el/la/al (a + el)

Francés le/la/au (a + le)

Italiano il/la/al (a + il)

Portugués o/a/ao (a + o)

Tampoco voy a entrar ahora de donde viene el latín.

Hasta Luego

Si la "c" estaba seguida de una "w" + "a", sí sonorizaba y se conservaba la w:

LATIN - Aqua >>> ESPAÑOL - agua

¡Bienvenido Amigo Boyeto! ¿ Sabra Ud. que esta en el foro íngles? In English, please! Your information is very helpful to us all.

It's an almost utopic enterprise trying to locate geographically the very first point where castellano was born at.

Anyway, anyone who has studied both castellano and latin, must to have realized that the spanish language is, in fact, a "mutation" from original latin.

In whole Roman Empire, latin was the official language, as it was originally speaked in Rome and the Sorroundings (The Latium province).

But, as we can imagine, most of the people (peasants, craftsmen, etc etc) didn't get a linguistic education, and they spoke the so called "vulgar latin", an incorrect but extended shape of the Empire official language.

The vulgar latin had many different shapes, and changed by time and place, becoming in the romance languages: italian, spanish, french, portuguese, romanian, (and many minor dialects as catalan, galician, etc.). If you compare those languages with the original latin, you see that they are unquestionably variations (or, if you prefer, "degenerations") of latin.

We're talking about processes that took centuries. As long as the Roman Empire ruled, all of the written latin was a correct, official latin. But we know that at the same time existed many variations of vulgar latin.

When Spain became a united kingdom, one of the various shapes of vulgar latin (that we call "spanish" or castellano) was adopted as official language. At the time, castellano was a widely used language.
But it's very difficult to say "spanish was born at Place P, Yeay Y". In my opinion, that makes no sense. Languages are born by long processes, not as if they were grown up as a tree in an isolated place. Commerce, migrations, wars... there are many ways to extend an idiom, and to make people interact with another people.

¿What's the influence of germanic, arabic and native american languages in spanish? Mainly, it's a matter of vocabulary.

There are many words, specially words that begin with "al-", that came from arabic. Under the muslim government, former roman-hispanic citizens kept on speaking their vulgar latin. But, as they learned, for example, technical and scientific stuff from the arabs, they also learned the words associated. Many small towns and villages kept, virtually until today, the name that the arabic invaders (or in certain cases, founders) gave them. (major and ancient cities usually returned to their original latin name. (where I live, around Valencia -that kept its roman name, "Valentia"- there are many pueblos and towns with names of arabic origin: Albuixech, Alzira...)

A similar influence came to spanish from german languages... but the medieval german invaders were not as advanced and linguistically influential as the arabic.

The relative magnitude of arabic and germanic influence in spanish is small, compared to the latin main trunk.

The influence of native american languages is also small, but exists, mainly by the words thah the "criollos" (american-born citizens of european origin) or travelling spaniards brought to Spain. In the current days, we have an latin-american immigration, so other words could became to common use vocabulary (I heard, for example, some argentinian words used by some spaniards, as "orto" , that means "butt", and I believe that comes from Italian).

Anyway, it seems that the spanish made official by the Spanish Crown, was used in northern Spain, but I don't see any reason to suppose that in southern Spain people didn't talk a primitive spanish as well. In Al-Andalus, the muslim Kingdom, arabic was the official but not the majority language. The muslim governors were very tolerant about religious and linguistic matters: as christians and jewish were allowed to keep their religion, they could also keep their language. And vulgar latin, or primitive spanish, seems to have been the consensus language among the christians and the jewish. We must not forget that christians/jewish of "both Spains", the muslim and the christian one, were in close contact, as commerce and other ways of relationship were completely allowed.

Today, many people think that castellano was origined in a limited land, and imposed by the new spanish crown in the XV century. They give as example the existence of other latin dialects as catalan or galician, that are supposed to have "resisted" the imposition of castellano in the XV-XVI centuries. I don't think so. Galician dialect was born by the mere reason of Portugal being a separate Kingdom and the portuguese influence in Galicia. And catalan was born by the mediterranean commerce: it was a "melting pot" of spanish, italian and french words, as Spain, Italy and France were the business work area of catalan and valencian traders.

Basque does stand alone as a separate language of unknown origin, and this is maybe explained by the rural basque people isolation for centuries. That's why I don't believe that we could think in the truly basque people as a localized epicentre of castellano's birth. In fact, I don't believe in any localized epicentre of castellano's birth at all.

Of course, in mountainous and difficult spanish orography, communications ans trading were not easy, but they existed. And, even in those medieval ages, 800 years were pretty enough to standarize a vulgar speaking language for almost the whole Iberian Peninsula.

Many people think that spanish articles el/la and spanish sound "j" is due to arabic influences

is due to arabic influences....

-arabic has influenced in spanish lexical[about 2000 words ] [Also latin and greek have a semitic influences ; i don't know how many words have a semitic origin]

-Some latin words that began in S- (like Succus > Xugo > Jugo) was replaced in J-

-The spanish suffix -í (like marroquí , alfonsí ...) also is due to arabic influences.

not all that ending with -í is due to arabic , of course.

En cuanto a la palabra agua ;no sé de dónde ha salido un posible origen árabe de "agua" (DERIVADO DEL ÁRABE AL-WAD!!!)y es la 3º vez que he leído curiosa teoría.

The spanish word Agua (without a doubt) derives from Latin Aqua < indo-european *akwa

So , ITALIAN acqua , ROMANIAN apã , OCCITAN aiga , PORTUGUESE água CATALAN aigua , FRENCH eau ... Where do they all come from? from quechua?

Greetings to all

Well, I certainly got a good lesson on Spanish language history. Thanks Fernando and Booklady . I found it very intersting. BTW...Boyeto, I quite agree with you, agua does come from the Latin word aqua.