Fernando,

Until the Madrid government admits and deals with the issue of total independence through autonomy, granted by the Cortes to Basque Country in 1936, many people believe that the Spanish government is "occupying" Basque Country.

The fact is, the independence was granted by the last legally elected government Spain had before the death of Franco.

Franco, by decree, overturned the ruling of the Cortes, and maintained a stranglehold over the people, and subsequently made their language, Euskara, illegal.

But - if Spaniards fail to recognize this fact - you can expect decades of violence in the future, and the problem will not go away.

Like I said before. The climate for ETA to exist is greatly the fault of the Madrid government. If they didn't want it to exist, they'd uphold the rulings of the Cortes in 1936, not conveniently dance away from it like most people who feel the Basques should not be free from the control of Madrid conveniently do.

I'm sorry. This issue is one that will never be resolved until real discussions for independence are started in good faith.

The very idea that Spaniards believe that what the Madrid government has offered the Basques as "generous" is disengenous to the situation at best.

Wolf

The government of 1936 has no legitimation nowadays, or at least has the same as Franco's governments or medieval governments, that is, nothing.

In 1936 that government tolerated and even praised burning of churches, prosecution of the political opposition and even freed everyone in prison. The last republican government reached power by a coup d'etat. Would USA recognize pre-independence governments as a source of legitimation for its laws???

We only recognize as the source of legitimation the Constitution of 1978 which was agreed by the majority of the spaniards (including basques) as a framework of good convivence. Autonomy was not the means to achieve independence, but the means to achieve a good status in which everyone could have its claimings satisfied to a point.

You are forgetting that more than half of the basques are more than satisfied with the current status.

It is a minority who wants to impose other status by violent means. And current basque government is just breaking the law to satisfy that minority.

Fernando

Fernando,

You're right. The elected government in 1936 holds no sway today. The rule applied to the Basques is that of a dictator, and the people of Spain are continuing that dictatorial rule over the Basques because it's convenient to keep it that way.

In 1936 both sides of the Civil War were burning churches and shooting Priests because of their politics.

In 1931, after the revolution, and election, that brought an elected party to office, the people lashed out at their largest oppressor in Spain, which was actually the Catholic Church that kept them in abject poverty while they became fat off the labor of the people. In essence, they asked for it.

But, in Basque Country, the Priests were leaders of the revolution against the Monarchy and Church ownership of nearly everything. They were with the people. They weren't harmed.

As for the "last" Republican government taking control by coup d'etat, that happened after the elected Cortes granted freedom to the Basques, and has no influence over what was offered. They were already free, before that upheaval.

So, when did the coup d'etat take place? During the war itself, and was totally political. When it happened, the Republican government had essentially been killed. But their laws were still on the books, and their decision to free the Basques, remained there, until Franco overthrew the decision through his powers as a dictator. It was not rescinded by a freely elected body of the Cortes.

In reference to political imprisonments, and killings, it was going on long before the revolution. The Monarchy was systematically having anyone who "disagreed" with their rule taken away without benefit of law, and disposed of. So once again, it was retribution we saw from the Republicans after they won the 1931 Civil War.

What would the US recognize? We'd recognize the laws and the decisions of a duly elected government over those of a dictator, but the problem is, in the US, we were too afraid that the Communists were entrenched in the 1931 Civil War, and actually helped to contribute their very rise to power with the coup you referred to at a later date. I'm afraid we screwed up. We should have answered the pleas of the people in 1936, and supported them. It would have kept the Communists from eventually taking control.

You say that over half the Basques don't want independence, but let's face facts. The Madrid government is afraid that may not be true, or they would allow the referendum.

You'd think they'd be happy to allow it, since they systematically moved non-Basques into Basque Country for decades to "dilute" the Basque influence over the region.

This was a calculated move by Franco to essentially "occupy" the region with non-Basques, who also were granted positions of authority, supported by the military, and given every feasible support to succeed, while the Basques themselves were held down, and the government tried to force them into submission.

What's happened in the region is in a great part the responsibility of the government in Madrid, no matter how you look at the issue.

Like I've said repeatedly, and CaliBasco has said as well, ETA will continue to function as a force until such time as the people of Spain live up to the agreements reached by the Cortes in 1936, or at least grant them a referendum that will allow them to determine which direction they want to pursue.

As for the majority of those who say they have left Basque Country for other climes in Spain because of the unrest, the majority of them seem to come from families that were transplanted to Basque Country by Franco in the first place. The ones that were sent there to dilute the Basque legacy.

Wolf

Umm, Wolf, it seems as if you are reading the propaganda of a staunch basque nationalist party. They are your opinions, but let me disagree:

Incomplete and unfair. The elected government was kicked out by a coalition of socialists and other forces by undemocratic means (after 5 tries of coup d'etat in the years between 1930 and 1932, of which 4 of them were of leftist parties which tried to impose a sovietic regime). The rule that apply over basques nowadays is that of 1978, a Constitution voted in democratic and free elections.

Incorrect. Only leftist parties were anti-clerical and anti-catholic. Anarchists, communists, socialists and radical republicans praised and organized burnings of churches, universities and schools.

Incorrect. Socialists organized a strike in order to ruin the crops of that year as a means to rise the unrest and achieve the dictatorship of the proletaries in a sovietic way. Only 2,000 of 9,000 councils supported the strike. Churches and clerics were attacked because leftist parties were absolutely anti-clerical. Spain was then majorly a traditional and ultra-catholic country.

According our Constitution a referendum can only be organized by the Government (the spanish one).

That is simply untrue. Franco heavily industrialized the Basque Country and Catalonia in order to ease the unrest. As the employment was created in these two regions, people from other regions migrated to them.

What has happened in the region is in the greatest part, in my opinion, responsibility of nationalists. The lack of culture and education ar the extreme.

ETA will continue to function as a force as long as there is people who think that terrorism can be justified by grievances happened a century ago and as long as some people think they can impose the rest their ideas by putting bombs or shooting in the head to those who dare speak in loud voice.

I think that some friends of mine and 200,000 basques would want to say something about that statement. It sounds to me like "they are jews, they are not germans" issue.

Even if it was true (which it isn't) it would be unmoral and really undemocratic. Are black americans true americans or africans? Are germans of turkish parents germans or turkish?

Wolf I really don't see your point. We live in a democracy agreed by the majority of spaniards (and the majority of basques) peacefully (for the longest period in centuries). Now the basque government, supported by ETA via its political partys' votes, try to get independent by illegal means (that is, breaking the laws)... and you say that it is fair because in 1936 there were a revolutionary pro-sovietic government which stated that the Basque Country was independent???? I can barely believe it...

Fernando