Just to say it once more. Tourist must be very careful with pickpockets. I had to warn this Friday in Sol to two tourist that this group of gipsie women were trying to stole the purse. I think they didn't even realize that I was crying them, although they saved their purse this time because they looked at me, and they move the bag. But it's incredible how naïve some tourist are, this two were eating a goffre with so much interest that they forgot their bag on the back which was going to be open. I don't know if people feel so safe that forget about the purse of what, but I always take my wallet on my front pocket and the money in the small one, and only take the amount of money that I think I'll need. And when I take a bag in the metro I take it always in front o me and very well closed.
This group of gipsie women is very easy to identify because they go always 3 or 4 women catched by the arms, they're always around Sol picking wallets .

Miguelito,

Does the Madrid police use sting operations to catch these people in the act, using undercover police? It would seen that might cut down the number of attempts, and put a few of them in jail.

It's nice to hear how you helped them. That was very considerate of you.

Wolf

It seems that the problem is that the laws are to soft. Policemen take this pickpocketers, they are judged but, as the crime is what is called "hurto" (stealing) and not "robo" (robbery, or stealing great amounts of money) they release them with no jail penalties or just with a small monetary sanction.

My question is: what is the government waiting for to put an end to this situation? It is gravely damaging tourism in big spanish cities as well as our reputation and image

Most of the times the thieves are inmigrants. An effort should be made to expatriate ilegal ones, because if they don't have a legal job it is logic that they would have to steal to live...

Fernando

Fernando has told you, the problem is with the laws, police can't do anything. Probably the solution would be to punish the people who makes many small crimes instead of punish an isolated small crime, because they're always the same people. I think they're studying it. But meanwhile we have to go very alert!!

Miguelito, they can't do that, then they'd be doing racial profiling and that would only make things worse! However...

They do need to do something besides just study the law! I know of a couple of immigrants that were actually involved in dealing drugs, were already in violation of their visas (they were there as students originally, but had long since abandoned their studies) had their papers taken away from them after being caught in a deal and that was the worst they went through. Eventually they hired lawyers to resolve their legal situation, and are now living in Spain legally, but not working mind you, they are cashing in on Paro and who knows what else?!? When an immigrant breaks a law (especially if their illegal)they shouldn't be given more chances to repeat their crimes, they should be sent back to their country. Its my understanding that their country has to pay for it, yes? If not, let's work on that! :p But it seems that Spain needs to make harsher laws on this and other crimes, even for spanish nationals for vandelism and other such things-who cares if its a kid, have him wake up at the crack of dawn every weekend for 6 months and have him/her do community service cleaning up the mess that gets made on the weekends. THEN see how the kid thinks twice and how the family gets involved in what the kid is doing when their sleep gets interrupted when their little spawn of satan gets picked up!

And of course, tourists need to be careful. Then they'll say because they got robbed they don't like a particular city or country- which is ridiculous, since it can happen to anybody, anywhere! Pickpockets are harder to deal with, so you have to be vigilant, but as for people begging etc. I've found the best way to deal with them is to look them straight in the face and say NO! and keep walking- they'll move onto someone else. And if someone trys to stop you and ask you something you don't understand... don't stop and play charades with them, say sorry,you don't understand (Lo siento, no entiendo) and KEEP WALKING!!!!! Best way not to be a victim is to be aware!

I can see what you're all talking about. Espe, I like your idea of public service, and automatic deportation of anyone convicted of a crime. If a person doesn't appear in court on the date they are supposed to, they could be tried in absentia, and when picked up for any reason, automatically deported, or in the case of a citizen, put in jail if they failed to meet the requirements of the courts.

It is a problem for tourists. If you lose all your important documents, as well as VISA and ATM cards, you could be in deep trouble. How do you continue your trip? For that matter, how do you even get home in some cases?

It is an issue everywhere. I guess the problem that we all have to face is that pickpockets may very well pose a physical danger as well. If you catch them in the act, who's to say that they wouldn't attack you with a knife, or any other means at their disposal? It isn't too hard to believe that it's a small step from picking a person's pocket to holding them up at the point of a knife.

I know it's something that always concerns me everywhere I go. Having had my pocket picked in the Madrid Metro, I am very careful to make sure it can't happen again. I just hate the idea of always having to be concerned about it, and knowing there's so little that can be done about it.

But, we always have to remember that it isn't a problem that's just associated with Madrid, or Spain. Pickpockets operate almost everywhere in the world.

Wolf

Sorry, Espe, I think you didn't understand me well, the law I was talking about, was for everybody, Spanish included, although maybe it'll be harder for inmigrants. I think that stealing a wallet with 100$ is not such a crime to go to jail, because jail make you more criminal and so on, but maybe if you steal 5 wallets you should go...
About the implication of inmigrants in crimes I'm not sure if it's as high as they say. When they talk about crime statistics they include people catched with no papers, which is the most frequent 'crime'. It's true that there are a lot of mafias that commit crimes against their own countrymen, but this is something more grave and different from the small crimes of pickpocketting we're talking about.
Again, about the gap between pickpocketting and violence, I think it's bigger than Wolf thinks, as the law is much harder against this type of crimes in Spain, and usually pickpockets are too coward to have a direct confrontation with the victim.

no one likes having to be constantly on guard but it's a fact of life...especially on the road and when you're carrying everything of importance on you...
but attitude means everything...pickpockets prey on the weak, and inattentive...
rule #1...pay attention!
rule #2...watch your back or watch your travel companions back and have them watch yours...
rule #3...when they swarm you...start swinging...
rule #4...especially when travelling solo...keep your wits about you...the only time i was almost picked was returning to my room alone after a late night out in amsterdam...luckily i wasn't that out of it...so even though he thought he had "easy pickins" lined up, it wasn't to be...and i bet he was sore the next day...

I have provided the police with a full decription og the 4 girls who are pickpocketing in sol and they do nothing. It is so frustating and I just want to punch them right in their grinning faces.
Unfortunatly they probably have a family who are also on the wrong side of the law. So for now this is not a solution. How about a picture gallery of her on this site?

How about reversing the whole thing?!

Get a group of people together, obviously different shifts as people have lives... and stake out the pickpockets the way the pickpockets do regular people. When you see them about to do something, well, you just kind of stalk them they way they do their victim. They are bound to notice, and so is the would be victim and the more they get harassed, maybe it'll make it less appealing for them to rob people... I love the bubble I live in in my head! I know, its not realistic.. but can you imagine!?

I know its going to be a part of life, but only if we could keep it to a minimum! There's got to be a way.

Miguelito, 5 times.. well I like the 3 strikes you're out better. I agree that lesser crimes considering that it is something that can be deterred more easily, should be treated differently but let's not let them get carried away either! Community service for vandels and how about lessons in humility for thieves. Let them stand in the middle of Sol with a sign around their neck, I am a thief! Done military style, have them stand for a few hours (time directly related to offense) maybe holding some buckets of water in each arm with their arms out to their sides! :p Shame them into doing (hopefully)something productful with their lives!

Sorry, but for the money that they steal, someone has worked the hard, and honest way for that, its not theirs to enjoy! The victim may not get their money back, but give them some justice!

Madrid is not a violent city at all, the problem is pickpocketers who steal tourists.

I've not been pickpocketed, robbed or stolen in my whole life and I'm a citizen of Madrid. I have been in Sol, in the streets in the center, until very very late at night. I've also been solo while there, and never get pickpocketed.

It is not my innate skill to elude it (though as any of you in your respective places of residence have some experience on what to do and what to avoid to lower the chance of being pickpocketed). The problem is that the pickpocketers target systematicly tourists because:

1) they are easier targets,
2) have more money with them,
3) are going to leave the country in days or hours, so they would not court them,
4) are more confident,
5) are not used to their methods,
6) can be easily identified,
7) have other valuable items (as passports, cameras, etc)
8) they concentrate in key special touristic areas (pickpocketers outside those areas are much more rare)

Thus, until the government did something to stop this shaming situation for us madrileños, extreme the measures to avoid pickpocketing.

1) Don't have your wallets at hand (for example in your back pocket, put them at your side).
2) Don't let people come near to you. Madrileños are quite friendly, but this is a big city and unless someone asks you we don't go everywhere watching for someone who is in trouble.
3) Hide cameras and maps, you may take pictures but try to have someone watching around you. Look at your maps inside a shop or restaurant.
4) Try not to have bags or have them always at sight.
5) Separate the money and the documents in two wallets if possible.

Try not to be obsesive, be careful, use common sense, but enjoy! And if you know a local go with him!

If you get stolen at all: Ask someone where's the nearest police station (better a comerciant, clerk or waiter) and tell the police. They may help you if you lost documents, or perhaps if you are lucky they may find your goods and send them back to you.

Fernando

Miguelito,

Theft at the point of a gun or knife, or picking a person's pocket is still theft. Treating it as if it was littering, and letting these people continue operating with impunity isn't in the best interests of Spain.

Since the majority of people who are robbed by pickpockets are foreigners, Spain is sending us a message that it's okay to steal from us, if you're willing to pay a fine for being naughty.

The point is, the theft of one wallet can amount to thousands of dollars, and in my book, that's a felony, and the person should be dealt with in a way that includes a prison sentence. You have stricter laws for parking tickets than you do for these criminals.

Maybe jail after 3 or 5 times caught? Are you kidding? Putting them in jail will make them worse criminals? Hey! They've already found their niche in the world of crime, and it pays well. Probably better than a lot of people make working for a living.

So - To all wannabes who'd like to go to Spain to live - going over illegally - The way to make ends meet is by being a pickpocket. Just keep a few bucks handy to pay the fines, and you should be able to support yourself quite well on your earnings. Hey! They won't even deport you like they would if you overstayed your visa and had a real job.

Isn't there something wrong with that picture?

Wolf

Couldn't agree with you more Wolf. What's wrong with prison the first time. Ah, the days when the Guadia was on every street corner and every Plaza with the grease guns. The strong police presence made for a very safe city.
The problem in Madrid nowadays is not pickpockets and thieves per se, it is that the streets are crawling with them. I had two encounters with them in three days. If the police made an effort to thin them out, it would be helpful. But when I talked to the police after both encounters, they complain about the number of police on the force and the bureaucracy.
I really can't understand why there is not a greater effort to rid themselves of illegal immigrants. I was under the impression that the government was very particular about who they allowed to stay in their country. When my wife worked there, she had to check in with the local police station and prove she was there legitamately.
Oh well, it's good to see that the government of Spain is no more accoutable than our government here in the U.S.

What you folks have said is true, you have to take responsibility for yourself if you don't want to be victimized as a tourist, whether you are in Madrid,Spain, in Rome, Italy, in Orlando, Florida, or New York City. You have to be attentive and aware that in even the most wonderful places, there's always going to be unsavory people waiting to take advantage of the unwary happy traveler.

I know we joked a lot about hiding our money and important documents in our underwear as a precaution, but it is very effective deterrent! I will definitely buy a Wonderbra or its French equivalent for my next trip, thanks to Churrocaliente's tip!

Wolf and Gazpacho, the 3 strikes your out thing would work on a scale. First offense.. well, slap on the wrists, second, I don't know, but something that hurts a bit more, and third, Jail time! Or if you're illegal, well, a one way ticket back to wherever you came from!

The illegal issue... well, the EU as a whole is trying to figure out what to do. I've heard that Germany has the strictest laws... I think they should just adapt that and make it the same in all of the EU countries (because if they don't all agree, the illegals will just go wherever its easiest!) I know that's a proposal- maybe not to use Germany as an example, but about all of them having the same rules to deal with illegal immigration. Unfortunately, why do some of the more important things take so long to fix?

Hi there,

Pick pockets don't go ONLY for tourists in Madrid! This summer, riding on the metro, my husband Carlos got pick pocketed!

A butch of LatAm natives got on the metro I think at Sol, then got off at GranVia. They were pushing everyone. My husband was wearing shorts with a velcro pocket in the front. Somehow, they took out his wallet, took only the 4B (debit card with less protection than a regular VISA) and his DNI (national ID).

We discovered the theft when we went to pay in a store. He had cancelled his card 3 hours after being robbed and they had already spent 1,500 Euros! We, finally and just recently, were able to get our money back.

But, everyone needs to be careful and use common sense!

Keep safe,

Val

What Val says is true. Anybody can be subject to pickpocketing in any area that´s crowded enough. Everybody needs to be careful.

And as for the penalty the pickpocketer gets... well, if there is no intimidation, it´s 24 or 48 hours. But even if it were more than that, I think it is better if you are not stolen.

I don't think any of us thinks that the pickpocketing is only towards tourists...just that tourists, because they are in an environment not their own, need to use more common sense than a person who is from a particular area, because obviously, as a native, you have more options- complain, getting your money back (as all that takes time a tourist doesn't have) and natives are more familiar with what's what, and the kinds of scams that go on. A tourist unless they find a board like this one, or LP or a million of others, isn't likely to know of the scams until they are a victim.

My family born and raised in Spain, I've had an Aunt mugged in the doorway of her own building, another Aunt, not once but pickpocketed 2x in the metro (from her purse!) I've chased someone away from another one of my aunts, mother and I as were were walking down the street, trying to sell us a farola and one of the few times that the person actually FOLLOWED US!- which is why I say eye contact and a strong NO! is important, and other stories from outside my family also. So yes, it happens to EVERYBODY- but like Wolf said, tourists (anywhere) are a favorite target because they stand out, and yes, they ususally carry more money with them- this stereotype is especially true of americans, which is probably another reason why there attractive to a thief! So, to people, past, present, and future tourists, consider yourself warned. Pay attention, use common sense and you'll have much more fun!

I don´t think starting is the word. The biggest group of inmigrants come from Ecuador and Colombia, followed by Morocco. At least that´s what I read on the newspaper El Pais last week.

Quintos, STARTING to have immigrants from Latin America?! Where have YOU been?! I also think this is a whole new thread, but...

As far as the Peruvian immigrants being the ones that seem to most want to actually make something of themselves, I don't know but:

Let's hear it for the Columbian and Equitorian mafias that are starting shootings and helping raise crime to a whole new level!

Let's not forget that there are some AFRICANS who also own their own business in Madrid. They run hair shops and are doing quite well for themselves. Not all Africans sell drugs in Madrid.

Just a mention of this so that Africans aren;t stereotyped.

Shawn

Since the previous post mentioned it, Spaniards tend to categorize people from the continent of Africa into North African or Magrebi, and sub-Saharan. The general prejudice being that the N. African are the troublesome ones. Those from what is considered black Africa are generally seen as quite inofffesive. Most day to day dealings with them involve buying pirate CDs in the street. Of course all Africans do all sorts of things, but these I find are most people's general impressions. They are not mine of course.

Lets not even start on the Latinos (Lat Ams, Latin americans)in Spain. For that matter, African, former soviet block either. There is no nice way to say this but, Ya Basta! I respect any and all who work for the betterment of the community and who are willing to intergrate and adopt the local ways. But I have seen MANY of the above listing who are nothing but parasites and leaches. There I said it!

Electracity, let this be a message to those who still believe in Socialism. The government of socialist states teach people to be leeches and parasites. If it wasn't for the small, evaporating pockets of capitalism in this world, things would be much worse around the world.
Canada should take heed.

Electracity, I agree with what you have to say. There are people of all races and cultures who work to better their environment and some who just WON'T. That's the way of the world.

Shawn

"Canada should take heed"
Gazpacho, please explain. I wasn't aware I lived in a commie country. Do all of you Americans equate the word 'socialism' with 'communism'? Are you really that ignorant of the country north of you. This is all getting so tiring.

Dargus,

Don't indict all of us for one person's opinion. That's kind of unfair, don't you think?

Wolf (Who also doesn't believe the McKenzie Brothers represent all Canadians either - )

Wolf,
I agree with you and apologize as I was responding to a post implicating ALL Canadians (I guess it works both ways - one person implying we ALL represent one's opinion) in the same light as illegal (or legal?) immigrants who chose to diss and destroy the values of the society that is supposed to assist them in starting a better life. We have the same problem here as does every freedom-loving nation on earth and it is a big problem. It's just that this statement:

"The government of socialist states teach people to be leeches and parasites. If it wasn't for the small, evaporating pockets of capitalism in this world, things would be much worse around the world.
Canada should take heed"

Implies that I, as a Canadian am a leech and parasite. And ALL of my fellow hardworking democracy-loving fellow Canadians. Yes we need to build up our military substantially. Most of us are furious about the status quo. And we are CAPITALIST! The context of his message implies we are not (grrrr!). Thus my asking of his knowledge of Canada (it does seem to lack, though).
It astounds me that Gazpacho's post is tied into the previous posts pertaining to certain immigrants being thieves and parasites of society. Our Prime Minister is a bozo. Many of us up here agree. We have an election in early 2004 and I hope we can vote the man out. I don't always agree with President Bush either and I don't have to if I don't agree with it but that is the beauty of democracy. But to categorize us as being leeches and parasites is offensive. How many Americans take Pat Buchanan seriously?

Please be aware that I attended the funeral parade for our four fine military men who died in the unfortunate, forgivable friendly fire incident in Afghanistan where both Canadian AND American flags were being waved. I live in the city where the largest number of oil refineries in Canada sit. We are a target up here. Half the city could go up in smoke if we do not fight against terroism. I guarantee you that if the UN resolution is passed to attack Iraq our men will be helping out the best we can as we did in Afghanistan. My city is where most of our military is based out of so I have deep ties to it.
My response was emotional and these are emotional times in the world today but one must remain as rational as possible to ensure the tough decisions today are the correct ones. I am not one who likes to argue (especially with a guy like you Wolf...your reason is to be admired) but some comments just $@!& me off.

BTW Canada's great national pasttime, the Grey Cup (our pro football championship) is being held in my city, Edmonton, this weekend and this is where the sleepy Canadian patriotism really comes alive as people from all over our vast nation gather and party and have a great time.

So cheers to all!

Dargus,

I didn't take offense. I understand totally how emotions sometime run. I have no idea how Canada was thrown into the issue of pick-pockets in Madrid.

I'm an old Saskatchewan Rough Riders fan from way back. The days of Ron Lancaster and the battles with the Eskimoes. I saw the '67 Grey Cup game. It was fantastic!

Wolf (Enjoy the game. Should be a good one.)

Dargus, my sincere apologies. No, Canadians are not leeches and parasites and Canada is certainly not yet a socialist country. I have many Canadian friends around Toronto, I live only forty miles from the border, and I get Channel 9 here from Windsor. I love Coronation Streets on Sunday morning.
I mentioned nothing about communism in my post, but unfortunately, yes, I do equate socialism with communism. Both have a blatant disregard for private property, and without private property rights, we are all slaves, dependent on our big government masters for more and more of the necessities of life.
My message to "take heed" is my concern with the direction Canada is heading. And for what it's worth, my own country is heading in a similar direction. Two things contribute to my concern. One, I know from talking to Canadian friends and watching Canadian news, that even your "conservatives" are liberal. They are very much for a bigger government. And two, socialized medicine. Here in Michigan I here many stories about Canadians coming to the U.S. for medical treatment that their own system can no longer provide for them. That's why I believe that Canada is leaning toward socialism.
I am very happy that you take issue with my post. I pray, there are many people in Canada that dislike being called socialist. I got the term "leeches and parasites" from a previous (Canadian) poster. I don't really think the term is fair for the types of individuals he was describing. Rather, the people that flee from socialist countries because their government cannot rob enough producers in their country to pay for the necessities of life for the nonproducers, are so dependent on their former government, that the importance of providing for themselves by being a producer is lost. Therefore, they turn to crime upon reaching a wealthier country, such as Spain and Canada.
Again, I apologize for the generality of my post. It was more aimed at the previous poster than at your great country. Long live hockey.

Please, let's stick to the topic: Madrid pickpockets again. Thanks!

Sorry for asking but... do really americans in general think that socialism and communism in capitalist countries are the same as the communism in communist countries?????????

I can't see our socialist party (PSOE) or the communist party (IU-PCE) breaking the laws to take every private property... And I'm sure that they don't defend the same ideas.

Fernando

Interesting question...in my opinion, many Americans don't fully understand what Socialism is and unfortunately mistake it with Communism. Although the two ideologies share a few similarities, they are clearly different. Also, because we're very proud of our democratic roots, and many Americans felt triumphant with the fall of the Soviet Union, "Communism" is still used as a derogatory epitaph.

Hope this helps, without violating MadridMan's request to stay on topic.

Fernando, no, they don't.

Gazpacho, you're WAY out of line! Your comment has nothing to do with the pickpocket problem of Spain. It has always existed, as does in the majority of big cities, and the problem with this and other similiar crimes in Spain are elevated because of the illegal immigration as well as the soft laws that don't yet provide enough protection or deterrant to this crime. The immigrants of many of the countries that are flocking to Spain, I'd hardly call socialist... the governments of many of these places is a joke, and that's even if they HAVE a government! Mostly its just dictatorships, chaos and poverty. Problem is people leaving their country and going to another one expecting things to just be given to them, because they say so, not because they've earned it. mmmm, seems like a popular american mentality... that's an entirely different thread.

Take the political comments to another thread, oh! and make sure you know what you're talking about! By the way, there are many 'socialist' (I put it in quotes, because they are socialist/democratic)countries that work very well, have a good handle on their crime and have low tolerance for criminals... which is more than I can say for the US in many cases!

let's try to get this back on topic...
why are there pickpockets in tourist areas?
because that's where the money is!
it doesn't have anything to do with illegal immigration...or socialism or communism...
pickpockets are opportunistic feeders...period!
and all the "enforcement" in the world, short of execution, will not rid you of the problem...
i enforce my own anti-pickpockting "laws" if i catch you with your hand in my stuff i break it!
scumbags are scumbags...they come in all colors, races and ethnicities...

Thanks Big Jamon for sterring us back in the right direction. That's why I made the last comment that I did. We all know that thieves, criminals live everywhere, NOT JUST IN SPAIN.

Have a great day,

Shawn

Bien dicho Big Jamon, Well said. Pickpockets come in all sizes and colors and sexes. These folks,sinverguenzas, are shameless and fast on their feet!

Unfortunately I have no skills like you do for breaking any body parts, but I take my precautions.

booklady...you have no idea how easily fingers snap...
but violence isn't for everyone...if you sense someone has their hand in your pocket just step to the side...that usually leaves them with a pretty puzzled look on their face...and it generally makes it hard to take what they were aiming for...
but the best protection, by far, is BE AWARE!
distraction is the pickpocket's ally...and if you're already gawking their job is half done...

one other thing...my mother has used the term "sinverguenzas" for as long as i can remember but i've never seen it spelled out...

Big Jamon,
Your Mom and I are probably contemporaries! The proper word is desvergonzado, but I got carried away and used the slang term, by the way there is an umlat over the u, but I don't know how to make it! The slang term makes a better impact than the proper word, don't you think!

Sinverguenza is a very descriptive term!

booklady...don't know about you and my mom being contemparies...ella es una sevillana...left in '36, been here since '39...
never heard that word used except for the slang...i heard it mostly while she was driving...it is a great word...i can use it in context but was is the translation?

Big Jamon,
Your Mom is my Mom's contemporary, I learned the term from her, and she is an Asturiana. So it must be a Spanish slang term of that time, passed on to their kids. It means shameless,someone having no shame whatsoever, a descarado, but in Spanish it sounds better. My Father added further
expletives, that made it even more colorful!

Booklady,

BigJamon: literally its 'without shame'.

Its still very much alive and in use.

I agree with you both! And there's a few other choice words I can think of... and Booklady, if you can muster a shout! It won't put anyone in a cast, but the 'susto' will take a couple of years off their ticker! :p

sinvergüenza
sinvergüenza
sinvergüenza

je je je...

Booklady,Espe, Big Jamon and gang, you can put the umlat if you download the international keyboard from your windows control panel/keyboard.

Have fun with your ümlats, áccents, and tildes ñññññ.

I had the impression that we were talking about what to do about the thieves in sol. I still suggest a picture of the offenders so other members can see who they should be aware of....
There are also another scam going on but I have still not seen it in Madrid but in Marbella.
It is a credit card scam. All but one cash machines in a well visited area is jammed and the last one have got a false front which catches your card in a litle plastic loope. The cash machine keeps asking about your card and when you press enter to return your card the machine breakes down and tell you to contact the bank. It is the quite easy to retrive the card by removing the false front. Many thieves who uses this scam also install a mini/micro camera which is able to read your pin number. If you loose your card this way it will cost you a lot.... Make sure that if the cash machine is "eating your Card" There is a reason. The false front does have a smaller slot for your card so you are not able to see that it is just inside...
Be aware..

Espe3, I usually give the Librarian death stare! The one we give bad, unruly patrons, that usually keeps them at bay!

Chica, gracías for the tip! I tried looking for an umlat for a u and did not find one using the number lock keyboard.

DaisyE, what a nasty surprise! It's a good idea to use the ATM machines insde a Bank, or after hours the machines inside big Hotels.

i've read about the new ATM scam...they're doing here in the states too...here's how to beat it...
insert your card and then cancel transaction BEFORE entering your PIN...if the card comes back you know the machine is OK and then you can go and do a complete transaction...if your card is kept...you lose the card but since you haven't entered your PIN, no harm no foul other than a lost card...

WRONG they can still use your card without your PIN. They just make a false ID and learn to write your signature..........
And loosing your card on a holiday can be a big problem......

OK they can try to steal your ID...but w/o PIN your money is safe...
and i don't sign my cards so they can't forge my signature...

But with the check cards (atm/credit cards) if it gets stuck in the machine, call and cancel right away. They're still going to have to come out from behind to go use it. By that time its already reported stolen and BAM! Busted!

NEVER delay canceling the card!