The following is an email of one couple's terrible BAD LUCK in Madrid earlier this year. Keep in mind that these kinds of things are FAR from the norm, but they do happen from time to time.

Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:52:02 -0400
Subject: Things you should know and tell people
From: <XXXXXXXXX@juno.com>

We were headed for a vacation in the canaries and your page inspired me to add 4 days at the end of the trip to see Madrid. Your information is wonderful. I love your pictures and all the information you provided BUT, you must warn people. I write this because you said to send you input:

We went to Madrid for 4 days. I hated it and it nearly ruined our whole vacation. Yes, the buildings are beautiful, and the streets are alive, and my 9 year old loved being out for dinner at midnight when everybody else eats BUT, within the first 15 minutes of hitting the streets, I was pick pocketed of all my money, in broad daylight, by these two girls that were putting flowers on my husband and I and pretending to tell us about some feista at 3:00. (They got nothing from Michael, my husband, though they tried).

On day 2, within the first 15 minutes of venturing out, again in the AM, as Michael was standing in line for Dunkin Doughnuts, he had just paid and that was the last time he ever saw his "new" wallet that we had just bought in Lanzorote with his money and credit cards. (And we hadn't even left Dunkin Donuts yet)

On day three, we had just gone out to get the metro, were suddenly shoved and separated into the train, squished and shoved, they tried both of us, in M's pockets and my fanny pack, worn on my front, was left wide open, it was actually the scariest of all, but by now they had nothing left to get. I hate Madrid. Couldn't get home soon enough, and will not let ANY of my freinds go there!!!!!!!!!! Coming from the hotel later that day I overheard an "American" talking and asked her if she had just been robbed, she said YES, she had just come out of a cab and they grabbed her pocket book and raincoat right out of her hands.

I'm sure if you're walking around, looking non-touristy, and speaking the language, they leave YOU alone. but this is what happened to us and it had never happened to us anywhere else in the world. It's a really horrible feeling. (Just thought you should worn people of all the "professionals out there)
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Again, this kind of thing is far from the norm, but does happen from time to time. Just be smart, be safe, be alert, and you'll be fine.

Saludos, MadridMan
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Love flamenco guitar music? Visit MadridMan's ALL Spain Market @ http://www.MadridMan.com/allspainmarket.html

[This message has been edited by MadridMan (edited 07-01-2000).]

i am so sorry to hear about this...

were these people wearing targets? that would still not justify what has happened... it's like the people killed by the drunk driver and it was not their fault they were driving at that moment. they were merely the vicitims of a nonsensical act. i apologize for the misery this must have caused these people on a vacation far from the comforts home...

but i have to stand with MadridMan on this, that it is NOT the normal thing to be robbed like this. i suppose that others can only learn from this, so that will be the only good that comes out of it.

perhaps travelers should make an extra effort to "fit in?" i don't know... we all are who we are and that can be difficult to try to fit in, especially when you do not know exactly what that means if you have not been to a specific place before.

i certainly advise that people who are planning a trip to Madrid and who have not been there before should read that story and therefore be aware that this does happen, despite all of the continuously wonderful things that we write about the people and culture.

anyway, i suppose a drunk driver can get any of us. we just have to be aware of our surroundings as much as possible...

I returned to this page to say how much I loved Spain, especially Madrid. I also wanted to restate the pickpocket risk in Madrid.
I had never experienced anything quite like it either- on separate occasions, my friend and I had attempts made at the Plaza del Sol metro station. I say attempst because we had read much about this and were constantly watching out for each other when in the company of strangers and therefore thwarted the thieves. While nothing happened here, I would not go near the park next to the Palacio de Real again- nite or day-.
I wear a neckwallet for money, cards and passport and suggest this to anyone concerned with security. It looks dorky but is worth it.
I look forward to a return to Madrid. It is now one of my very favorite cities in the world. I'm sorry that these folks had such a bad experience.

This is a shame, but at least they left without gaining anything from you. The neck bag/wallet is a great thing and I recommend it to everyone. If you have to carry everything with you I think this can be even better than a moneybelt as sometimes you can't feel a moneybelt being slashed from the back.

The Puerta del Sol does have a notorious reputation as the "home of pickpockets" so one must be particularly careful here. Here AND when at El Rastro (flea market in barrio lavapies).

Cannhorn, you never said what happened (or didn't happen) at the park next to Palacio Real. Was that the Campo del Moro (down the hill from Palacio Real) or Jardines de Sabatini (on the opposite end of the palace from the cathedral of La Almudena)? What did you see? Please tell us so we can all learn from it.

Still, I'm happy to know you found Madrid and Spain to be enjoyable and interesting. I can't wait to go back for my 4th trip this October.

Saludos, MadridMan

Well, we too are batting 1000. Twice been to Madrid and twice robbed.

Last year it was me. I am a fluent speaker and was thought to be South American by most Spaniards... what I'm saying is that I didn't scream tourist. However, in a small sandwich shop Pans and Co on the Grand Via, a suspicious manager and employees orchestrated the stealing of my purse, right from bewteen my feet.

Later that day... 4 more people were robbed in this Place. Watch out for Pans and Co. on Grand Via!!!!

This year, we stepped off a bus and walked across the street when two small waiflike girls lifted my friend's wallet from her purse. This was near the Atocha station and the McDonalds at Reina Sofia museum.

The girls passed it off to a 3rd party and the wallet vanished!!

WATCH OUT. MADRID IS A DIRTY, SCARY PLACE WHERE YOU HAVE TO WATCH EVERYTHING EVERY MINUTE. Sadly, there are lovely sights and places to visit which are overshadowed by the street trash.



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me quedo completamente alucionado.... se que este tipo de gentuza existe, pero bueno...!

ok, so i am 1 meter 90 (6 foot 3) 200lbs and male, is this why nobody steals from me?? maybe... but i swear i've been all over madrid at all times of the day and night and never had a problem ( and i have probably looked like a tourist and i have been with tourists...) this is really bothering me all this about pickpockets and crime...

thanks for the info about pans and co. i think this might be the most useful info yet about crime in spain... (the fact that the employees of a legitimate business would orchestrate a scheme such as this...{edit})

MadrídMan, ¿que piensas tú? does anyone else out there have any pickpocket stories?? i have only one mugging story that i know that i will post later.. but i would like to hear about other's experiences (while these wounds are all still open )



[This message has been edited by real_megia (edited 07-09-2000).]

What do *I* think? I think it's terrible! I get emails about pickpocketting and muggings from time to time, including from texachica, and it always makes me sad. What *can* I think? I don't think this is the norm because I, like you real_megia, am 6'1", 210lbs, strong build, and can't look like anthing BUT a tourist (maybe this last part doesn't apply to you, real_megia).

All I can hope is that those who cry "PICKPOCKET!!" are not the norm, but rather have the loudest voice while the great majority who have wonderful, eventless visits to Madrid just don't speak up.

It's terrible. Don't misunderstand. Pickpockets, while existing, are not the norm. I can't believe this. I don't want to believe this and probably won't until it happens to me or until I see it happening to someone else. We all hear stories, sometimes from the victims themselves, but more often it's secondhand information and I hope the story got embellished down the line.

It's a shame and I wish the police could do more, but hey, like in NYC, there are millions of people and only 1,000s of police to cover the entire city. At least...at the VERY least, these crimes, while very upsetting, are almost always petty, danger-free crimes. Sure, there are also strongarm and/or knife-wielding muggings, but people rarely get harmed.

I also feel so totally safe when I'm in Madrid, day or night, no matter where I am. Maybe it's a false sense of security or a safety-in-numbers kind of thing, but I never have fear in Madrid and this is something I REALLY cherish. Most of us in the US have fear in our daily lives with boisturous, loud, or agressive "characters", the prominence of handguns, the semi-common lack of respect for life that we know some of these "characters" have. At least in Madrid I feel I'll always return home safe and sound. Afterall, what's money in the big picture. In the pickpocket's eyes (and much of the time it's reality) we're rich tourists and there's always more money to replace that which we lose to these kinds of petty crimes. Hey, at least they're not shooting first and taking your money after.

I hadn't intended this reply to get so involved. In general, Madrid is one of the safest large cities in all of Europe and probably in the world! Be safe, watch your stuff, and keep one eye on your partner's back(pack). Take care and enjoy Madrid!

Saludos, MadridMan

[This message has been edited by MadridMan (edited 07-07-2000).]

Real_Megia: 6'3," 200 pounds; MadridMan is 6'2," 210 pounds, but size doesn't matter to pickpockets. The time I whirled around and gave a gypsy pickpocket a chop to the throat in Barcelona, my son (6'1," 190 pounds) and I (6,' 230 pounds) were their 'targets.' Last year, I was targeted twice (that I know of) in Santiago de Compostela. It's not size: it's how vulnerable you are perceived to be and the pickpocket's estimate of the value of what he (she) can take from you. It's a 'risk-reward' system. Sometimes they will take extraordinary risks if the 'prize' appears to merit them.

You can't do dumb things (i.e., leaving your purse, or camera bag, or whatever on the ground while you 'sort out' your pesetas) you might get away with routinely at home.

Speaking of 'dumb things:' Last Year, I was in Santiago at a Tuna Universitaria concert just outside the Basilica. It was really great! Everyone was applauding, their hands over their heads and I followed suit - until I remembered that this left me vulnerable to pickpockets. I lowered my arms just in time to see a young man squatted down alongside me - ostensibly caring for a small child; But this wholesome looking couple with small child fit the description I heard an Italian victim / tourist giving to the police inside the Basilica. Count my lucky stars!

I have been fortunate so far (knock on wood) but I don't think it's all 'luck.' I try to be aware of everything going on around me at all times. When I see a distraction in the Metro, I immediately go on 'full alert,' not knowing if I am the selected target or if it is someone nearby.

[This message has been edited by Eddie (edited 07-26-2000).]

So what is the best way to respond to a would-be pickpocket? Is it proper to respond with physical force or what?

This is a great question, alejandro. I'd like to think that I could elbow an attempting pickpocketer in the nose to get his hand out of my pocket, but my only concern would be that I would then be held by police on assult charges since there would be no proof that the pickpocketer was trying to take my wallet (I don't carry a wallet anyway) and NO ONE wants to be held in ANY foreign jail.

Also, many of these pickpocketeers carry knives (to cut open purses, bags, whatever) so unless your reflexes cause you to "drop him" and get away quickly you might be up against more than you expected; something SHARP! And NO ONE wants THIS!

Saludos, MadridMan