I'm going to Spain in March and bringing my 15 year old son along. In the US he dresses in big jeans and cargos (I'm always telling him to pull them up!). I'm trying to convince him to bring some pants that actually fit him around the waist, guessing that this ridiculous fashion doesn't fly in Spain. Am I wrong or right?

Hi ellenoregon

This is one I am familiar with :p

As long as his boxers/CK's/whatever are the right ones he'll be cool

Jo

Here's some good questions for Spaniards et. al.: If ellenoregon's 15-year old son wears is baggy, droopy cargo pants, tennis shoes, and (possibly) ball cap (baseball hat) around Spain...:

1) Will he be denied entry to some restaurants because of his attire?
2) Will potential pick-pocketers yank his pants down around his ankles in order to rummage through his pockets?
3) Will he be targeted as a foreigner/tourist?
4) Will he feel out of place or more comforted in his unique-ness?
5) Will he return from his Spain visit wearing the latest "cool" Spanish fashions and impress his friends?
6) Will he spend the entire trip in the hotel room taking advantage of the free high-speed internet access (i.e. GoMadrid's son at Hostal Adriano - hehehe.. )
7) Will his clothes turn off the girls in Spain?

Just a few things to consider when packing.

Saludos, MadridMan

The question is not so much will he look out of place, as much as do you want to be seen with him out in public of another country looking like a punk gang banger. The Spaniards have seen enough American movies to know what to associate that type of clothes with. So don't look for some band of Spanish girls to start following him around wanting to go out with him. Frankly if he was my kid, he would either straighten up and toe the line, or stay at home and play with his video games while I was in Europe.

P.S. Take that book you have on how to raise children by Dr. Spock and throw it in the trash.

I believe that dressing is a very personal issue, however, I can answer some of the MM questions

1) Will he be denied entry to some restaurants because of his attire?

Yes. In some restaurants he will be denied access or he will feel like an alien.

2) Will potential pick-pocketers yank his pants down around his ankles in order to rummage through his pockets?

Not probable :p

3) Will he be targeted as a foreigner/tourist?

Without doubt. That kind of dressing is extremely rare in Spain (though not unseen).

4) Will he feel out of place or more comforted in his unique-ness?

That depends on him As I have said, he will be targeted as a foreigner for sure, and he will be the only one dressing like that in miles around.

5) Will he return from his Spain visit wearing the latest "cool" Spanish fashions and impress his friends?

Again, it depends on him and what he likes.

6) Will he spend the entire trip in the hotel room taking advantage of the free high-speed internet access (i.e. GoMadrid's son at Hostal Adriano - hehehe.. )

That would be a crime! There is so much to see and to enjoy in Madrid for a 15 years-old guy.

7) Will his clothes turn off the girls in Spain?

Maybe, or maybe the uniqueness will attract some girls. It's difficult to say.

Perhaps the best would be to carry a variety of clothes so he is able to choose what to wear once he sees how people dress in Spain. If he feels comfortable being the only one wearing big jeans and cargos so be it. But suggest him to bring some more clothes to avoid something as fool as this ruin his trip

Fernando

In case you want to give your son a hint on teenage fashion, you can introduce him to springfield (the teenage oriented brand of the Spanish fashion giant Zara)

http://spf.com/

The site shows basically the trends for middle class teenagers in Spain, choosing spain as country in the menu you get what they are selling now, so you can more or less show your son how the landscape looks like.

Thank you Fernando and nativo for great information. Desert dweller drop your weapons and relax. Perhaps you need to visit a high school and get reoriented to the next generation.

I think you are the one that needs to get in tune with reality. I have been to high schools and seen the way they dress now, along with their attitudes. It is a least three times a week that one will walk into my shop and want a job. "I ll keep you in mind"

"Well don't you need my number?"

"No, I got that when you walked in the door."

So much for him and his you owe me attitude.

No the Spaniards are not going to be impressed with your son or you. I think you will find that in most of Europe the parents are in charge of the household, not the kids. You are the one that most of the scorn will be directed at.

Stay safe and have fun.

So much for no personal attacks??!!! Judging a person solely by their clothes, sure limits your outlook.

I have to agree with you that I think this silly style of your butt hanging out is laughable, not sure how they could run should the situation arrise!!

However, every generation wants to looks stupid in something. It doesn't mean you don't have a smart, capable child willing to learn and work. Remember that these "kids" you aren't giving a chance now will be the ones screwing with your future...good luck!

To each his own...

Ditravelphoto: There is an age old saying "if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, its probably a duck." I have several friends with high school and college age kids. Interesting to note, the way they dress is also reflected in the grades they bring home.The sloppy dress carries over into the grades.

Your comment about some of those kids I send packing out of my shop. If he isn't smart enough to pull up his own pants, why would I want to trust him around power equipment and high voltage?I have one working for me now that is 27 and has been with me since he was 15. I will be the first to admitt that I have hired some that I lived to regret.

As per you comment about them being the leaders of the next generation, I am not concerend about a kid 18 years old that does not have enough brains to pull up is own pants ever being in a position to cause me any problems.

Veering wildly off topic here, but I must have been a bull in a former life as I cannot resist a red flag waved before me

hummmm....you know who we re-elected for President...right??

and it's CHOOSING not to wear their pants like you and I would....(which again I will say is one of our stupider fashion fads....but then again, I think just about everyone has a photo in their album of something they wore that was SO COOL at the time that they are now embarrassed to show to anyone.) You remember peer pressure and the grinding need to fit in and be accepted at that age? They would probably wear a monkey taped to their head if everyone else did it. It does not make them stupid, just human. It would serve all of us if we took the time to teach them that following the herd is not required, nor is it particularly beneficial.

I will also have to agree with you that there is an attitude of entitlement and disrespect in general from a large number of teenagers now. But that does not create a blanket statement about all of them...stupid pants aside.

He is just a 15 years-old kid... remember when you were that age DD. It is not really that important.

Fernando

Let's put this back on track. If EllenOregon wants to take her kid to Spain and let him go out in public looking like an idiot she has the right to do so. The Spanish people take pride in their everyday appearance. They have also seen many movies from Hollywood that show the sort of dress she is talking about and the type of people associated with that appearance. Let us be honest, Hollywood has not painted a very nice picture of the people who dress in that manner. Further the family unit in Spain, the parents are in charge of the household and not the children. Most Spaniards would not allow one of their kids to go out in public dressed they way Ellen's son does. If she does elect to allow Jr. to wear that attire in Spain, she better be prepared to for some rather scornful looks and comments directed her way, as well as the direction of Jr.

Ellen has worked hard and saved for this trip and it should be a pleasure not torture. She came to this site asking for advice on if she should allow her son to dress as he would in Oregon. My input is simply not no, but H*ll no. She is going over there to have a good time and the trip of a life time. The looks and remarks alone would spoil anyones trip. If Jr. does not want to take moms advice then when she gets over there and after a few stares a remarks she can take him to El Corte Ingles and dress him like a Spanish kid.

I hope that Ellen does have a great time, as she has earned this trip. When she getts back I hope she will post and let us all know how it went. At the same time I would lay the law down to Jr. that he is not going to go over there looking like that. As Fernando said, it is rare that you see that sort of attire.

I agree that it’s not very common to see people dressed that way, but I don’t think it will necessarily ruin her trip if her son dresses the way he does in Oregon. No matter what he wears people will more than likely be able to tell he’s a tourist; although he probably will stand out more by wearing the baggy jeans.

I think a lot depends on where they’re going in Spain and what they’ll be doing. If they’re in a big city like Madrid the madrileños are used to seeing people from all over the world with lots of different fashions, so I don’t think it would be too shocking for them to see an American teenager in baggy pants. But, if they’re visiting some small village he’s sure to attract more attention. Also, it’s not the same if he’s walking around touring during the day or if he’s having dinner in a nice restaurant.

Regarding what desert dweller said: while you won’t see a lot of the really baggy jeans I sure have seen a lot of 15 year old Spanish girls in Madrid dressing in a way that I wouldn't want my 15 year old daughter (if I had a daughter) to dress—things like incredibly short, tight mini skirts or low-rider pants with the thong sticking out (which isn't really that much different that the baggy pants with boxers showing for the boys).

Good point Meg. Somehow, I suspect Desert Dweller won't be complaining about the teenage girls dressed in "incredibly short, tight mini skirts or low-rider pants with the thong sticking out." As for the boys in baggy pants--I've travelled many times with our teenage son (now 16). The rules we use for packing are based in practical matters i.e., travel light. We pack almost no t-shirts, because cotton knit doesn't wash and try well in the hotel sink. Our son wears silk/rayon/poly-cotton woven sport shirts for travel--they're comfortable in summer, and dry easily. Baggy pants take up too much room in the suitcase, heavy jeans are hot and they never dry after washing them. We don't let our boy sag his pants anywhere, but a good compromise has been to buy the baggy style, but in a size that fits the waist--hence no boxers showing. I like the suggestion of buying a few popular fashions in Spain at Zara or El Corte Ingles.

Regarding Desert Dweller's comment: "Frankly if he was my kid, he would either straighten up and toe the line, or stay at home and play with his video games while I was in Europe." I hope you aren't a parent. If a 15 year old kid can't "straighten up", then the last thing he needs is to be left alone for weeks while his parents tour Europe! Better that he joins his parents (baggy pants and all) for some enforced family time in Spain, where children are allowed to accompany their parents everywhere at all hours of the night.

I'm going to disagree a bit here.

I get to see thousands of "kids" every day at Complutense (in Madrid) and baggy pants aren't all that unusual--though the skinny, graphic t-shirt, funky-chic thing is more in style right now. What will make him stick out like a sore thumb are big athletic shoes, huge t-shirts, a baseball hat, or any kind of US sports team paraphenalia.

But I wouldn't recommend any draconian tactics. Let him wear what he wants and see what reaction he gets. Having one's world turned upside-down and being the odd-one-out is a great learning experience.

And isn't one of the great things about being a parent telling your kids what you think, watching them ignore you initially, only to get to see them discover later that you were right all along?

Well, you ladies have been reading the posts very well. Of course I would have no objection to the way those young chicas dress. Long live the mini skirt.

Very Interesting discussion, especially the last comment by Desert dweller. At least you have the honesty to admit your bias. I thank the others for their perspectives. It is important to understand the messages of clothes in context. Apparently to desert dweller, baggy pants equals worthless kid. This is hard for me to square with my son, who gets straight A's, swims every day on his high school team, and reads faster than anybody I know. No, he does not look like a gang banger, there is a range of fashion that is discernable to those who look, but I wanted him to be unobjectionable in Spain. His response to all this is to opine that he will bring his least baggy pants, and would be glad to visit clothes store in Madrid if I want to buy him Spanish fashions. He has no basball cap or sports t-shirts so he will not otherwise advertise his American origin but we can't help being tourists!

DD I think your attitude is way out of line, You are the one who has to realise there is more out there than you know about. Respect everyone and never bring anyone down by the way they dress especially a 15 year old !!!

Kenny: That is a real startling revelation that someone would say I have a bad attitude. What was your first clue? I think if you spent some time in the US you to would come to the same conclusion as me about the American male attire. Once in a while one will be "just going along with the crowd" but it is so rare that it is not worth talking about. Juvenile crime rate is so rampant in the US now that I think you would be amazed. I have hired my share of teenagers over the years, most of the time I have lived to regret it, they don't want to work they want the paycheck. A few of them have proven me wrong.I have one that is set to start work on Monday of next week. He has a line of bs, we shall if he can turn that into cooperation and production.

Ellen: Those young chicas have a more pleasing presentation than the young males. When I see those young ladies with their minis and low riders with the thong, it brings back a lot of pleasant memories. Some times the sight of one of them can have more of an effect than Viagra. Yeah I know, DD is a dirty old man, I have heard that before also.

My wife was born in Madrid and we visit her relatives frequently - we will be there mid-Feb to mid-Mar this year. Are you planning to travel outside of Madrid? Madrid is very cosmopolitan and fashions run the gamut. My wife's younger cousins clothes tend to reflect their socio-economic level. Not sure where the "slacker" look fits in. It is a good decision to take a variety of clothes and wear what is appropriate for the situation.

ditravelphoto - Your comment really applies to those who we almost elected the last two times.

As a 20 year old, this topic has given me quite a few laughs!

Ellenoregon's son is not going to be the first or the last young American male to set foot in Spain wearing baggy pants. The reaction he gets is going to depend entirely on what part of Spain he is in, and who sees him. If he wants to ensure that he will not get picked on by any Spaniard, he should find a good pair of tight-fitting jeans, preferably boot-cut and with the "whisker" wash, a good pair of comfortable shoes that aren't tennis shoes, and a nice, button-up shirt with a collar (not too dressy, not too casual) or a tight t-shirt with a hip screen print (not sports related.) Now, if this guy can find any clothes that fit that description in the US, I give him kudos! And plus, I bet that if showed the description I just gave to any of his friends, they would promptly label it "gay." So, I would let the guy decide for himself. Option one is to buy clothes in Spain, and wear them and look like a hot spaniard. Option two is to dress like an American, and have everyone know he's an American, and have people make fun of him. But the reality is, that even when dressed in Spanish clothes, Americans still manage to look American. The question really is: Does your son want hot Spanish girls looking at his butt in tight jeans, or does he prefer they see it covered in baggy pants and boxers, neither of which are in style?

Ellenoregon, let us know how the trip goes, and what your son's reaction is! I'm very curious now!

Super Lau: Good to get some input from some young blood with true knowledge of the subject.