I have read alot of good things on this site about casa patas. Does anybody know if the flamenco show at casa patas would be appropriate for two 12 year old girls (accompanied by a parent)? I would appreciate any info.

I don't know the particular place you mentioned - but have seen numerous flamenco shows and never once was there anything to cause the slightest bit of concern as far as the two girls are concerned. We fight very hard in this country to try and let our kids stay kids - the pressure to grow up way too fast is prevelant. Not so in Spain - I wouldn't worry at all. I saw you other post detailing the trip - we will all be anxious to read about your experiences! Have a wonderful time - and tell your daughter and her friend there are a whole lot of people here that would like to read their impressions of Spain also.

Puna - So how would you explain the fact that many kids 12 and up smoke in Spain? I think there are alot of adult aspects to spanish life that kids are exposed to...such as the prevalent pornography in the streets for example.

Leche

Hi breibach! You'll find a lot of useful information about Casa Patas in Madrid in the " Flamenco in Madrid & Spain " thread. I used the SEARCH link above/right and used "CASA PATAS" as my keywords. Keep in mind that most flamenco places start very very late (by USA standards) at around 11pm or midnight, but you might find some, more touristy ones earlier. Have fun!

Saludos, MadridMan

Puna-- thanks for your advice. I have read that Spainards take their children out for evening entertainment. I will be spending the entire summer in Spain with the two girls and I want them to experience as much as possible. Also don't want to exclude them form evening activities. Madridman-- thanks for the advice on the flamenco thread. I will use the "search" feature. I focused in on Casa Patas because I want to avoid the touristy places. I assume there is still some authentic flamenco and its not all for tourists.

You may be able to find an early evening show featuring folkloric music & dances in Madrid. As for me, I would much rather see a group dancing 'Jotas Aragonesas' than one that just does Flamenco. The folkloric show will also feature 'Sevillanas,' which are the more classical brand of flamenco.

If someone were to ask me what is the national dance of Spain, I would have to reply: the 'Jota.' But there are so many variations: The Gallegos dance the Jota and the Euskadi dance the Jota and the Catalanes dance the Jota, each with its own distinct flavor; but the Jotas that I love the most are the Aragonesas (Jota de la Dolores, for example). So don't get 'bogged down' with Flamenco. Try to take your girls to see a group dancing the Jota: Happy music, joyous dancing.

Hi, breibach,

I agree with Eddie's advice. I also prefer la jota over flamenco. It sounds like you have the summer very well planned already, but here's a recommendation. If you can get up north to Aragon, and the town of Jaca specifically, around the first week of August, you can experience the Festival Folklórico de los Pirineos. This festival happens every year - the odd numbered years in Jaca, and the even numbered years in Olorón Ste Marie, just over the border in France. It is absolutely INCREDIBLE! For one week, the best folkloric groups from literally all over the world go to Jaca and dance in the streets from early morning to late at night. They also put up giant tents and have spectacular shows every day, and the parades are not to be missed. The atmosphere is electrifying, and, on top of all that, you get to see the best of all the Spanish regional dances. Not only is it international, but groups from all over Spain perform as well. You would get flamenco and so much more.

I've been in Jaca several times for the festival, and without a doubt, it's one of the best experiences I've had (and I lived in Spain 13 years). The girls will love it, too. There are kids everywhere, running around getting autographs from as many people from as many different places as possible. And Jaca is one of the most beautiful, interesting places in Spain. If you decide to go, though, be aware that hotel space fills up way ahead of time for the festival. (The tourists are for the most part Spaniards and other Europeans. I could count the American tourists I've run into during my many stays there on one hand.)

Sorry for going on and on. I tend to do that about Jaca....

Leche, In the main, I think kids smoke because they grow up in homes and societies where smoking is common and accepted. You also see youngsters being given watered-down wine throughout Europe. That was not the kind of pressure to 'mature too quickly' that I was referring to; there's a huge difference between a kid that most of the time thinks and acts like a kid and one that tries to think and act like a 25 year old.

Alot of being able to be a kid is the environment they are raised in - I do believe the Spaniards and their society foster that.

It seems in may ways to be a societal thing. From personl experience, Hawaii was a good place to raise my kid - LA wasn't - and part of that was the pressure in LA to be an adult too soon.

[This message has been edited by Puna (edited 12-26-2000).]

Eddie:
Any idea where we can see an example of the jota in Madrid. I will be there this summer.

Hi Puna,
I started to smoke when I was 15 years old, and you don't know how much I regrete it. In Spain is okay to smoke when you are young, I believe the age is 16 but I've seen 13 year old kids smoking. It is maybe because we never thought that smoking is so debastating for our health, I guess we didn't have too many campaings telling that smoking is bad. Another cause is that many years ago a kid was an adult very soon. Kids had to work in order to bring money to home (Spain was poor) and you were adult so early, so if you are an adult to work you are an adult to do what adults do (smoking, drinking...). Nodays everything is different, a kid go to school (is obligatory) and most of them go to High School and then to the University, but smoking and drinking is okay. I must say that maybe we are not right but I prefer the Spaniard system, here in USA you are allow to do some things when you are 21 and I believe that most of the people are able to make their own choices when they are teenagers. The important thing is to inform that if you do certain things you have to take the responsability and you have to accept the consequences, if you smoke/drink you are putting at risk your health, if you have unsafe sex you might end having a baby too soon. I believe that if you talk to your teenager and give them the facts they are enough responsibles to choose what is right. On the contrary if you forbid something they will do whatever in order to try the "forbidden fruit". Well, that's my opinion, I might be wrong, but I believe that if you teach to your teenager to take responsability soon and accept their mistakes they will turn into fine young men/women.
Leche, about the pornography... I don't know what to tell you but that is NOT pornography. Do you see any add of people having sex? Or girls doing "Stuff"? Those are naked bodies and I believe that a naked body, exposed in an elegant way, are not ponography. Some people think it's art. I am happy that in Spain we have the right to express ourselves even through naked bodies, in USA, the land of the freedom, you don't have that right even when the constitution says the contrary. One fact is that (except some exceptions) many girls that I met here have had sex with many guys (some numbers are really high) you won't have many girls in Spain who had sex with a lot of guys, specially the "one night stand". If those adds are dangerous becuase they are pornography, how do you explain that sex in Spain is not as crazy as here in USA where you don't find that kind of "pornography"?
Besos...Nuria

[This message has been edited by Nuria (edited 12-31-2000).]