Thanks again for the continued feedback...it's most helpful as I fine tune our plans.

As far as the cochinillo goes...I don't like to eat meat that reminds me of what the animal looked like when it was alive....so I doubt I'll be eating that although I love to eat ham (just don't like to be reminded of the pig it came from LOL!).

I am glad to know the trains are safe and operational...although now some people are still suggesting I stick with the bus so I am not sure what we'll end up doing (train or bus).

I'll keep that in mind re: try to go to Retiro on Sunday. What should we do on Saturday morning? I doubt the Hostal Oporto will let us check in so early (we'll just leave our luggage I assume). If we were able to check in we might take a nap as I don't know how well we'll sleep on the overnight bus trip. Anyhow we'll have a few hours to wander around Madrid that Sat AM before catching a bus to El Escorial...where should we wander? What do you all suggest???

Someone said the beach isn't that nice at Tabarca. Is it worth going there? Is the snorkeling good etc.?

Sel mentioned seeing Alcazar in connection with El Escorial and Valley of the Fallen..where is this Alcazar??? We did plan to tour the monastary and then take the 3:15 bus to the Valley of the Fallen. I didn't remember reading about an Alcazar there.

Finally to those who commented on the business of the schedule...actually this is FAR less hectic than our trips to Italy and England/France the last two years. LOL! The June 6-11 part will be very laid back... I can be a very "driven" sort of person...had my PhD by the age of 30 if that's any indication. LOL! We want to make this trip a bit more relaxing than the last two (not that we didn't enjoy all the sightseeing we did in London, Paris, Normandy, Rome, Venice, Naples, Sicily, etc.).

rharton wrote: I've heard this statement numerous time, mainly from Americans who have visited Spain and (Mediterranean countries). The sight of a half-dozen de-feathered, headless chicken hanging from hoods in the market turns them off as do large, octopus, squid, and anything with a head (like fish!) lying on a bed of ice.

We (Americans - minus MadridMan, that is ) like our foods heavily processed, wrapped, and packaged so it looks only like mystery-meat-loaf, mystery cheese, or something that can be sliced easily and put between two pieces of bread (i.e. Pan Bimbo). And since I've got my motor already started, we Americans also prefer our beer to taste like lightly flavored water and we like our wines fruity (okay, this is a deep generalization as are the other statements to some degree).

While Spaniards (generalization) prefer to SEE WHAT THEY'RE GETTING before they buy it! Imagine if there was a chicken hanging in the pollería looking all brown and dreadful - but still edible. Well, obviously, no one would ever buy that one. But in the USA, take the same chicken, grind it up, bones and all (and I do me ALL! ), mix it with some other chicken and KA-BANG! It LOOKS perfectly fine, healthy, nicely bleached to keep the color consistent, and tons of salt added in order to make it more tasty.

¡JOD**, TIO!

Recently, I was speaking to an American on this very topic and they were, let's say, typical. They felt the same as you to no fault of their own, of course. ("Not that there's anything WRONG with that!" -Jerry Seinfeld) I asked them, "Well, you like shrimp, don't you?" They said they did, but not so much the ones with the legs on - they preferred theirs breaded and fried (i.e. "processed"). They gave me a story about ordering fish at some restaurant in the US and the head was still "attached" and they sent it back to be decapitated before bringing it back. hehehehe..

Enough food-related rants for the day. But rharton, if you close your eyes to these kinds of foods in their natural state, you're eliminating a LARGE part of Spanish cuisine - and it's some of the best in the world. Enjoy Spain!

Saludos, MadridMan

My mistake!! I meant the Monasterio de San Lorenze de El Escorial.

The buses are frequent but you need to get there early enough to get a seat. Sometimes they are full and you have to wait for the next bus.

This was the only bus that we did not have an assigned seat. We had to figure out which platform and then wait in line for the bus. I believe that we paid as we got on the bus and it was first come fisrt served.

The bus for Toledo has assigned seats so you do not have to wait in line at the platform to be assured of a seat and the tickets are sold at the ticket counter.

Enjoy!!

Madridman... I am sure you are right when you speak of the advantages of eating less processed food and food that you know more about the quality like you said. My husband does like seafood so I am sure he'll enjoy that in Spain. I don't eat much meat in general and when I do it's very unrecogonizable from it's original from i.e. ground beef, slice of ham, boneless skinless chicken breast, etc... Probably the closest I get to that is when I cook a whole turkey but still the head is gone when I get it. I don't even eat shrimp or seafood. But honestly the food in a particular place is not the main attraction for me. (now my husband would say one of the highlights of our trip to Italy was the pizza) We also are not into the nightlife... the main thing for us are historical sites (castles, cathedrals, museums etc) and natural sites (beautiful scenery, snorkeling, etc.).

A few questions you might be able to answer that I posted right above your "food rant" were... 1. Where would you suggest we plan on wandering about for a few hours early in the morning on a Saturday (in Madrid)?
2. Is the island of Tabarca worth going to (ferry from Alicante)?
3. Do you know what Sel was referring to as far as an alcazar in connection with Escorial/Valley of the Fallen?

Thanks again for hosting this wonderful site...reading many previous posts has been a huge help in my planning process...

Thanks, Sel for clarifying that...we are definitely going to see the Monastery in El Escorial...that's the main attraction, eh? We plan to arrive by about 11 AM so that should give us plenty of time before the bus to the Valley of the Fallen. Thanks for your helpful advice!

About Tabarca:

Tabarca is a tiny island (a rectangle of 1.1 miles x .25 miles) with no beaches. It isn't that the beaches are not so nice, is that they are inexistant. Snorkeling is a possibility there, but don't expect it to be the Red Sea.

You intend to do in one day (June 8):
- get to Calpe train station
- train from Calpe to Alicante
- climb up the Santa Barbara Castle
- go to the port
- catch the ferry to Tabarca
- stay in the island
- catch the ferry back
- go from the ferry terminal to the FGV train station in Alicante to catch the train to Calpe
- train back to Calpe.

Don't you think it is too much for a day? There are not trains nor ferries every 5 minutes, you will have to wait for them and it takes time. If I were you, I would forget the island and stick to the city of Alicante that has a nice beach in front of Santa Barbara castle and besides the FGV train station, called El Postiguet.

One more thing about June 13. This is your plan:
It is a Sunday. The museum opens at 10am. Supposing you are going to spend one hour visiting it, at 11am you have to go to the Bus station, that is quite far from the museum. If you take a taxi, with luck, you can board a bus at about 11:30am, arriving to Toledo at 12:45. That leaves you half a day to visit Toledo.

On top of this, June 13 is the day of the European Elections. I don't think this will interfere too much with your plans, but be aware that it is a 'special' day.

I would suggest you to shorten your plans this day, too...

Thanks again for the input... I appreciate the feedback re: Tabarca. I had switched my plans around for that day so that we would be taking the 11 AM ferry to Tabarca and returning at 5:00 PM and THEN going to the Castel because it's open until 7:30 PM. However it doesn't sound like Tabarca is worth going to...like you said we could go to the beach at Alicante instead. I had read somewhere that the snorkeling was really good at Tabarca, and we love snorkeling so that's part of why I was planning to include it. Below I am pasting an example of a description that I read on the web about Tabarca (this one is from "Let's Go - Spain and Portugal"). However I trust the judgment of someone who lives in Spain so we'll probably sratch Tabarca from the plans.

As far as Toledo...yes I was assuming we'd arrive around 12:45. It seemed that most of the places we wanted to visit in Toledo are open until 6 or 7:30 (and closed between about 1:30 and 3:30)...so I thought maybe that would be enough time. The only problem would be that if we left for Toledo earlier in the day we would have to scratch the Museo de America and Faro de Moncloa from the trip as they are only open in the mornings. Would the time be better spent in Toledo than at these two attractions in Madrid? Thanks again for all your help!!!!!!!!!

Isla Tabarca
Still a quiet fishing village, this tiny island 15km south of Alicante offers an old fort, several fresh seafood restaurants, a rocky beach with beautiful turquoise water, and several coves with tide pools perfect for a refreshing dip in the sea. Despite its petite proportions, tourists have begun to make the island a choice daytrip destination. The only beach is straight ahead when you come off the dock; rent beach chairs and umbrellas from an attendant (chairs €4.80 per day, 2 chairs and umbrella €9.60). To the left, the remnants of the tiny fort, once a jail for Spanish exiles, overlooks the Mediterranean on three sides. To find the tide pools, head to the right past the beach when you come off the dock, and proceed down the main street through the town until you reach a large stone gate. Walk through the gate to find several tide pools and small, rocky coves. Seafood restaurants line the narrow strip between the fort and the beach---all serve delicious comida típica with menús ranging from €7.20-9.

If Isla Tabarca was all that great, it would not just be tourists who were wanting to visit!!! I spent 8 days in Ibi, near Alicante and my hosts who had lived there a lifetime had never bothered to visit the island. We did visit nearby State Parks, Alicante, and other places. Much of enjoying Spain is relaxing and and finding things that are not written about in the tour books.

Toledo is a wonderful town that is full of history, adventure and places to visit. Whatever time you have to give to its visit will be time well spent. I start each trip to Spain by spending 2-3 days there and I have yet run out of things to do!!!

Some of our best days in Spain have been days with nothing planned. Something always comes along to fill in those days.

Thanks...you all have convinced me! I will scratch Tabarca from the itinerary and we'll just spend that whole day in Alicante....and the same goes for Toledo - we'll plan to spend the whole day there instead of trying to squeeze in a visit to the Museo de America and the Faro de Moncloa. Thanks again for your help... I love websites like this where we can glean input from people who know so much more about a place/topic than we do on our own!

Thanks for the food rant, Madrid Man. I couldn't agree more! And I would die for some cochinillo right now!

I, too, think that the itinerary could be a little looser. Sitting and watching the world go by, sipping sangria and eating tapas, striking up a conversation with locals....These are some of my best moments in Spain. I like sightseeing, but too much of it turns me into a horse with blinders on a frenetic schedule and I don't really soak up what is around me. (My pet peeve with many American tourists.) Don't be afraid to scrap your itinerary when you get there if you feel like just hanging out. Watch how the Spaniards do it. They are pros. You might like it!