Happy 30th Anniversary of Franco's death! Today was the day in 1975 and apparently it's a big party for the many thousands of fascists in the country. Yesterday I watched a huge demonstration parade by La Falange marching down Goya from Plaza de Colon. There were at least 500 in the march and many spectators that were happy to see them. They weren't goose stepping but they did the fascist salute quite a lot. Interestingly the crowd was mixed with younger skinheads along with the older Franco die-hards.

There was also a big memorial party at the Valle de los Caídos with around 6,000 attending yesterday. I´m sure today it may even be larger. It´s kind of sad to see such large numbers still interested in bringing back the memory of a cruel dictator and spreading their message of hate.

Only 500 in that march? Surely ABC will report there were more like 5,000 and El País will report 50. But seriously, folks, it's interesting that Franco's statues are removed around the country and yet the state permits parades in his honor. I imagine after another generation passes there will be no more "parades" for this ruthless disctator.

TVE SAT had all kinds of information/specials about Franco this morning. It was interesting from a historical perspective.

Saludos, MadridMan

As much as I would like to see the end of these parades, wouldn't it be pretty difficult to prohibit them in a democracy?

None of our newspapers echoed those tiny demonstrations (it doesn't matter if they were 50, 500 or 5,000, they were just a handful persons). I've checked 6 on-line newspapers (of diverse tendencies).

Anyway, if you see the elections' results ( www.elecciones.mir.es ), Franco's followers are a tiny minority:

Parties with at least one parlamentary in the Parlament:
PSOE (socialists): 11,026,163
PP (conservatives): 9,763,144
CIU (catalonian rightist nationalists): 835,471
ERC (catalonian extreme-left nationalists): 652,196
PNV (basque rightist nationalists): 420,980
IU (communists): 1,284,081
CC (canarian nationalists): 235,221
BNG (galaecian leftist nationalists): 208,688
CHA (aragonese leftist nationalists): 94,252
EA (basque leftist nationalists): 80,905
NA-BAI (navarran extreme-left nationalists): 61,045

Other parties:
DN (extreme-rightists): 15,180
FE DE LAS J (extreme-rightists): 12,266
FE (extreme-rightists): 10,311
FA (extreme-rightists): 4,589
AUN (extreme-rightists): 923
Rest of parties (all tendencies): 778,089

Extreme-right parties add a 0.17 % of the votes.

In France, extreme-right political parties add a 15% of the votes.

Anyway, as long as they respect the law (which includes not to support xenophobic or racist ideas, or supporting terrorism), they have the right to express their ideas and to rally.

Fernando

Fernando,
I have some questions for you. I recently saw a Spanish film called " Diario de un Skin ." It is supposed to be a true story based on a journalist from Madrid who infiltrates a neo-nazi group.
I don't know how true to life this film was, but it made me wonder if these punks are still causing trouble in Spain.

Despite the fact that they have few numbers in the Moncloa, are these groups growing in popularity? If so, do they also have a "fifth column" of supporters throughout the country?

When I lived in Barcelona I ran into a few of these fools. I am part Jewish and fortunately I decided not to wear my Star of David that day. I don't know what could have happened if I had decided to wear it that day.

They gave me a litany of stupid arguments against Jews, blacks, immigrants, etc. At any rate, I hope their numbers are diminishing and they end up in the trash heap of history.

Any comments?

Cogito cogito ergo sum cogito

It still chills me when I hear the quote from that day "Españoles. Franco ha muerto" (sometimes it's esta muerto). I think they must have been nervous days following the end of the regime. Would a communist uprising intent on revenge come to power? Would some ultra fascists take advantage to retain power? I think the end result has been the best outcome anyone could have predicted in 1975.
At some point it would be interesting to hear of any positive legacies left by the Franco regime. I can only think of one - the tradition of the menu del dia started (I believe) under Franco's regime. I understand it was designed to give the workers a chance of 1 good meal a day (remember that for a long time people were virtually starving). Oh, and possibly his choice of a successor to head of state, King Juan Carlos who in turn helped to bring back a democratic system.

Pingüino: they had less support than some years ago. Still, they are a loud minority which has support throughout Spain. In some places, instead of skins, you have other kind of young extremists (in the Basque Country the youngsters of ETA, in Catalonia both skins and radical separatists).

Still, they are a minority. You, and any other (including me) would better ignore them. It is impossible to argue with people like them.

filbert: I think I can be quite objective when talking about Franco.

He did lots of good things: infrastructures (marshes, highways, roads), tourism resorts (paradores,...), social achievements like Seguridad Social (free health insurance), compulsory education,... he also decided to stay neutral in WWII and unofficially accepted jewish refugees fleeing from Europe, and we had also a long period of relative calm (instead of what we had in the previous decades).

All in all, he put the foundation for modern Spain.

Still, his dictatorial regime was negative for Spain. Our rights and liberties were restricted, there were no political parties, no democracy, political prisoners, an international blockade, death penalty (specially in the first years in which five thousand oppositors and soldiers of the "republican" side were killed) and, in sum, a delay of two or three decades in the development of our country.

Don't believe anyone who label him either as a devil or as a god, he was a historical figure which had lights and shadows. It is more objetive to judge his actions than to judge him as a whole. Even the worst of the dictators (as Stalin or Hitler) were able to do positive things, and certainly, Franco, was not one of the worst.

Fernando

Democracia Nacional,España 2000 and some falangist groups are xenophobic and racist parties. From my point of view, they have to be prohibited.

Falangists celebrate N-20 because their leader, Primo de Rivera, died in the same day as Franco.
I don't know why the falangists are considered "radical rightist" and not "radical leftist" when they are against capitalism and they want an absolute socialist economy. Someone could explain that?

Falangists , as far I have read, are: fascists, patriots, socialists, ultracatholics, they are against separatism, against communism and surprisingly against racism. Of course, there are a lot of falangist groups so this could be true for a special group or not.

It's surprising that falangist consider that some members of PP are extremist. Here is an example:

Declaration of the falangists in the "Unity of Spain" rally supported by Foro de Ermua.

"The presence of Falange in the concentration (Foro de Ermua) was developed with absolute normality in general terms, if we except the attitude of the habitual supporters of the most extremist wing of the PP, that struggled to try to eliminate our placard and they undertook it against a poster with the motto "For Catalonia" carried by one of our supporters ... These ultraconservative elements represent the other face ...of the nationalists... they are the separatists[nationalists] and others the separators[PP]. To those who we formed part of Falange deserves identical rejection to us whatever they try to dismantle the common national project like they raise an idea of closed and excluding Spain."

It's also shocking that falangists are against the boycott to catalan products, and they talk in favour of the catalan culture, specially the catalan language. We cannot say the same about some PP followers...

falangists : "we are against the boycott of Catalan products that are as Spanish as the Andalusians ... and we are against the rejecting use of the Catalan language and culture that at the moment is only used like differentiating element and a hand-thrown weapon and not like which really they are, elements that contribute to the greatness of the Spanish culture. "

As was said earlier in this thread - no matter how much one might disagree (or dispise) a segment of society - democracy is based on the freedom to say what is on your mind and to be at least tolerated for it.

Actions can be made illegal - not words and thoughts .....

You should be proud to see them marched. If the shoe was on the other foot, if those marchers were in-charge, they would have you killed or sent to prison and the same thing would happen to your family.

So when you see those marchers, remember you know you are absolutely correct in your point of view because you tolerate them and they are absolutely wrong in their point of views because they would kill you or others that differ with them.

I have refused to visit the Valley of the Fallen when I visit Spain. Franco grave is there. I wonder when Spanish people will dig it up and move it to a place of less importance!

Bill