(Original Subject: "Madrid: Sp. children learning English?" Subject changed October 22, 2006)

Spanish Children in the 7 year old range: How can they study/learn English?

I'm asking for a Spanish "family member" who lives/works in Madrid and has a 7-year old. This 7-year old already takes a basic English course as part of his public school teachings but, of course, it's not much at all. In the last year, it seems he's not learned much more than "My name is ****" and "I am 7 years old" and "yes" and some basic nouns like "dog" and "cat".

Any advice on how to better immerse this 7-year old boy? Are academies the way to go? Maybe private, in-home instruction?

The parents think that 7-years old is a little late for this kind of instruction to take hold, that maybe his best years to someday become fluent have passed.

Thanks so much! Saludos, MadridMan

I've heard from experts in bilingual education that a child can become fluent, with no accent, if s/he learns the second language by the age of 11. Personally, I think it's possible to do even later, if the child/adult has a talent for languages. I learned Spanish as an adult, without classes, but I have an accent. My father learned English as an adult, and has virtually no accent. So they shouldn't give up!

The best way is total immersion, preferably with other kids his age. That's hard, and expensive, in Madrid. The parents may want to look into sending him to summer camp in the US for the summer (also expensive). If they want to do that, perhaps you could find one in your area that has a good reputation among local parents, and does NOT have a special program for foreign children. If he's the only Spanish-speaker, he'll have to learn English fast! And if you're close by, you can give him a break now and then and speak Spanish on the phone or on visits.

Private classes at home can be done. I gave private English lessons to two Spanish girls in Madrid many years ago. I concentrated on conversation, and the youngest, who was about 8, became particularly good at speaking in English. It got to the point that she was very comfortable talking about anything. The 11 year old wasn't that interested. The parents complained that I didn't do enough grammar within reading and writing, so the girls weren't getting the top grades in their school English classes (although they did hear the teachers say the girls spoke English remarkably well). That's the problem in many Spanish school English classes - they concentrate on reading and writing, and conversation is quite often ignored. Anyway, if his parents would like to find an English tutor, they should consider what the emphasis should be on (conversation, grammar, reading , writing) or work on all equally. The tutor should have experience working with children, and should be a native speaker.

I believe there has been a huge interest in Madrid in exactly this type of thing for many years. Spanish parents want their children to learn English and learn it well. There's a great market there for someone who can provide a good extracurricular program for teaching children English.

I've taught Spanish children in English academies in Madrid and elsewhere for a few years now, and it definitely does give children the edge over others who rely on the English classes given at school. For example I've taught advanced level 16-year olds whose peers at school (who had never attended an academy) were only intermediate level. Starting an academy at 7 years old would, in my opinion, be a very smart move. The norm is to attend twice a week for an hour or so at a time. Then the next step would be to do a summer course, here in Spain and then perhaps when they are older a residential course in Britain or Ireland, of which there are hundreds. I've taught many older teenagers who are fluent in English although they have never lived in an English speaking counry. They go to an academy during the year and maybe go abroad during the summer.
The other option is a private tutor. There are plenty of these in Madrid, although this can be expensive and perhaps a bit too intensive for a 7 year old.

WOW! What great input, you two! Thanks!

It's my impression that the parents would prefer in-home instruction as the 7-year old may find the academy atmospher too much like school and hence become bored - as he sometimes is in regular school. But I'm sure education is going to be "like school" no matter if it's in an academy or at home.

I'm sure there are some instructors which are wonderful teaching small children such as these which make the learning fun. I'm no teacher and try to speak to the 7-year old but, of course, he's not very receptive knowing that I can speak to him in Spanish. It does seem, however, that he does seem to pay attention, seems to be curious when I'm speaking to others in English. Or maybe it's simply that it's so foreign to him, maybe he's not really concentrating on what's being said.

Things much start slowly, yes, but I too think that the conversation aspect would be the best thing at this point, hopefully reinforced by school-taught grammar, structure, and vocabulary (if they really go into much debt, I don't know).

An summertime Enlighs immersion in a camp-setting sounds great but might be too much at this age, don't you think? I don't know if he could be away from his parents that long.

If only there were some kind of social groups in Madrid of children his age where English is the primary language spoken.

All children are different, all having different spans of attention, all having different abilities for learning languages. I just wonder what/which are the near-perfect conditions under which he'll have the best opportunity to learn English. How can this be determined?

Saludos, MadridMan

Hi MadridMan --

As has been previously stated, there is an increased interest in this kind of education (at this age), at least I have seen it in Madrid. I have gotten tons of calls this year from parents looking for classes for their children... the youngest was for a 5 year old.

Unfortunately for the parents, I specialize in adult instruction although do have two different groups of "teens" ranging in age from 11-18. However, that's the youngest I go.

There are several resources in Madrid...bilingual playgroups, story times, etc. that the family can take advantage of. One that I have heard of...but will have to scrounge around to find contact information is a playgroup called "Sticky Fingers".

Also, there is a used bookstore (English and Spanish texts) in the San Bernardo area called J and J Books and Coffee which has an English story time on Saturday mornings. The owners are a husband (Spanish) and wife (American) team and are really nice.

Academies that are set up for young children aren't too intensive. Obviously the parents should check out the style of classes and qualifications of the teachers. As I am sure you are aware, there is a bit of everything here in Madrid.

A few summers ago I taught at an English day camp that focused on children from ages 3-18. It was a well run program..it wasn't an overnight camp so the young ones didn't have any problems "being away from home".

Lastly, I recommend an in-home tutor. The family can go to Booksellers English Bookstore on José Abascal, 48 (metro Gregorio Marañón) where there is a bulletin board full of tutors and teachers offering their services. Right now private tutors are pricing themselves in the 15-20€ per hour range. If money is an issue, the family could also look into having a university student come to their home.

If you want some personal recommendations on tutors, drop me a PM and I will pass along some names and contact numbers.

EDIT: One last thing. A simple immersion technique can be having the child watch a familiar chidren's DVD (Disney, etc.) in English with English subtitles. Given that they are already familiar with the story line, they won't have too much difficulty following the story in English. After a few viewings, you'd be surprised at what they pick up!

More great insight, Chica, thank you! I just spoke with the parents in Madrid and it seems they would first like to consider the in-home instruction for their 7-year old. I'm sending you a Private Message with my request and I look forward to your response.

If anyone else has experience or knowledge on this topic I welcome any and all comments. Thanks!

Saludos, MadridMan

In my experience, a person can learn another language up until their very late teens and still be able to speak it without an accent.
I have several friends who came to the U.S. at that age, and speak English with no or virtually no accent.

If the parents are looking to pay for outside instruction in the language anyway, are they able to afford one of the bilingual or English private schools? Where my son is going is under 10,000 euro (fees only) per school year.

Good suggestion, ChrisR, but it seems they're happy having him in the local school nearby for general instruction and, at least for now, would prefer in-home English instruction. I'd also imagine they'd consider anything near 10,000 Euros annually as rather expensive although that does seem like it would be the best option to truly become bilingual. I'll mention this option to them, however. Thanks!

Saludos, MadridMan

Madrid also has public bilingual schools and plans on adding more in the near future.

I have 5 siblings and we all learned English at various ages after we immigrated from Germany, ranging from 7 yrs. up to 17 years...only the 17 yr. old sibling has grown up with an accent. It really just took one summer of imemrsion in the streets and neighborhoods around out new home and we were conversational by the time school began in the fall. By the time I was in high school ,teachers were schoked when I would tell them English was not my native tongue! So, definitely let this family know it is NOT too late!

I definitely think the DVD/video idea is fantastic. I use it occasionally now to try to re-claim my native German!

Play groups with other families trying to encourahe their children to speak English is a great idea and maybe they could start one if one can't be found.

I'm curious, since we are on the subject of language...Are any of you familiar with SPANISH teaching programs there (Madrid mainly) for high school students? Like one-2 week programs? my daughter would be interested in summer of '07 and we've found a lot for college bound Spanish learners but not high school.

Thanks for any feedback!

Tanja

Follow-up, nearly 1-year later. Still looking for an in-home English tutor for the now 8-year old. He's still energetic and does seem to understand me most of the time when I speak to him in English - although he answers me in Spanish. Requesting 2 days a week after school for 2-hours each time. Contact me directly via email or Private Message. Thanks!

Saludos, MadridMan

MadridMan,
Have you considered contacting American college students who are studying in Madrid for a semester or a year? I studied at Saint Louis University for one semester, and one of my profesoras asked me to tutor her two daughters in English. She just wanted them to practice talking and reading in English. So, I would go to their apartment once a week for about an hour or two and just play games, listen to English music, draw, and read with the girls. This professor often asked American students to do this so that her daughters (who were 10 years old at the time) would just become accustomed to native English speakers. They already knew some English from school. I don't remember how much she paid me, but it wasn't a huge sum, although she did give me bus fare, too. I was happy to have a little spending money!

Hi la historiadora! Thanks for your reply!

You wrote:
We're only considering someone with teaching experience and preferably someone with some experience teaching children. Teaching children (or just being around children) is MUCH different than being around teenagers or adults - as you probably already know.

The person we're seeking won't necessarily be a sit-down teacher either but rather a kind of play-partner in English. We think it may be more useful to use this method than a boring-ish, classroom "ME TEACHER, YOU STUDENT" - like method.

Saludos, MadridMan

I have to agree you can pick up accent free English upto your teen years by spending a summer in England or America. That is the way most people do it. Several other options are English TV or DVDs, that is how most expats I've meet learn the language.

thankfully getting English TV is much easier than it used to be. Every DVD offers English as well as Spanish TV has the OV option on certain channels.

From a cost point of view watching TV is probalby the cheapest, the other alternative is private english school. cost I believe is around 3000 a year. (much much cheaper than countries in Northern Europe)

I just discussed this very thing with one of my wife's co-workers on the way to the airport today (Chris and her had to fly out today rather than Monday morning as usual) Anyways her kids are 7 and 9 and she wants them to learn english as well. They do get a bit of English at school but very very little and like most parents in Spain the kids go to an after school academy, so they choose one that offered English lessons as part of the program. They have to drive a bit further but the kids get 2 hours a week with native english speakers and she said its really helped. They are starting to speak more in sentances etc. The price was pretty reasonable as well, less than private lessons, and the class size is limted to 6 or so.

I also asked about watching TV in English and when they were younger it was easier but now the kids are older they prefer Spanish.

Personally I asked what was involved in teaching kids as I have just finshed my TEFL (yeah for me) and I've decided that teaching children isn't for me. I'm going to focus on adults and businesses.

Hi again! I'm still looking for a tutor for the same, now 9-year old boy in his home for 2 or 3 days a week, 1 or 2 hours per day. Anyone new eyes reading this thread have any thoughts or direction apart from the above statements?

Saludos, MadridMan

Boink!

MM - you might want to ask Chica (Becky) - I'm sure she will be able to give you some suggestions if not a contact. For those that don't remember, Chica is an American married to a Spaniard - living in Madrid - and owns an English language school. info@iberenglish.com or rebecca@iberenglish.com

Thanks Puna! I'll do that. Last time I checked with her she didn't have any leads but maybe that's changed since then.

But the good news is a British message board member contacted me via PM and gave me the name of his son who lives here in Madrid and has experience teaching conversational English to children. We're going to contact him and see where it takes us.

Saludos, MadridMan