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#64174 - 03/11/04 06:21 AM
Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 136
Loc: Asturias
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Hi all, I`m visiting Madridman after leaving the following message at CNN website: >>>I have just been watching CNN news on the Madrid attack. Apparently, this 125 deaths were carried out by a certain "separatist group". Mind you, not terrorists at all, just a "separatist group", so I guess this was rather a battle than a terrorist attack, wasn`t it? And I guess also that 9/11 was some sort of political demonstration from commited Muslim believers, am I right? >>>I can`t stand CNN hipocrisy on this subject. Believe me, this is not the best day to demand me for simpathy on Americans.
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#64175 - 03/11/04 06:32 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 08/18/00
Posts: 225
Loc: Colmenar Viejo, Madrid, España
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CNN as an objective source for news was discredited long ago when they admitted doctoring the news in order to be allowed to remain in Iraq. This is all too common in journalism today, and especially in the politically controlled US press.
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#64176 - 03/11/04 06:52 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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I too have been watching CNN as well as internet TV and listening to Spain/Madrid radio all morning for all news. CNN did happen to mention that ETA is on "USA's Terrorist" List". It's a dark day in Madrid. Very, very sad.
_________________________
Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64177 - 03/11/04 07:19 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 136
Loc: Asturias
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I am happy that you are OK, MM. Really. I have just phoned to see if my friends over there are safe. You know, one half of Asturias moved to Madrid in quest of a decent job. As to the CNN they are just “reporting”, they are “impartial”, now they have just told about Jack Straw “standing shoulder to shoulder with Spanish people”, which is of course a good thing. And I guess I should be grateful that they went as far as “reporting” that the federal govt. has included ETA in the terror list. Well I should be grateful, but I am not. I am in RAGE. And you know, MM, as I do, that had it all happened in the US, CNN wouldn`t call ETA other than terrorists. Now they say ETA inmates in prisons are celebrating the massacre. SOBch!!!! A sad day, indeed. No one loves Madrid more than you do, MM. Please don`t feel involved by my words. OK?
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#64178 - 03/11/04 07:31 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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I'm a bit worried and still trying to contact friends and "casi-familia" (near-family) in Madrid but lines are busy or no one is home, etcetera. There are even people I know whom use those stations on their way to work at the hour the bombs were detonated. I have my fingers crossed ("tocando madera") and hope they are well but am completely saddened for those who were killed or injured.
UPDATE: I've fortunately been able to contact friends and "family" in Madrid and all are well. Thank goodness.
Sadly, MadridMan
_________________________
Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64179 - 03/11/04 07:56 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 152
Loc: Madrid
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First of all my heart goes out to the families of those killed, hurt, or otherwise affected by this despicable act of terror. While I caution not to jump to conclusions until the a preponderance of facts are in, I certainly hope those in power have the courage to root out the evil and cowardly vermin.
Secondly, and forgive me for interjecting my raw feelings here, but wrt to the comments of Cristobo Carrín...
"I can`t stand CNN hipocrisy on this subject. Believe me, this is not the best day to demand me for simpathy on Americans..."
What the f*** are you talking about? You should be ashamed of yourself to equate the politicalspeak mumbojumbo of CNN, an entity beyond any semblance of control of 99.99% of the everyday Americans, to the sentiments of the American people and particularly those Americans, new immigrants, and foreign nationals who died on 9/11 by similarly despicable and cowardly hands.
If you are unable to distinguish bewteen the two or differentiate among the innocent, powerless, and powerful, then it is you who are brainwhased by pop media.
Such comments are sickening and belie a true ignorance of geopolitics and the common man. Shame on you.
Almohada
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#64180 - 03/11/04 08:12 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 136
Loc: Asturias
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Almohada The BBC is refering also to the famous "separatist group". I don`t know who is to blame, but it is obvious something goes wrong in the English-speaking media. I am glad to hear laypeople don`t share their biased, inmoral views. I think I have kept polite all time, certainly I DO respect American victims of terrorists. I just hope the same from others
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#64181 - 03/11/04 08:19 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 12/16/03
Posts: 46
Loc: Valencia
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I agree with Almohada: "Cristobo, What the f*** are you talking about?"
To me, TODAY is specially a day to feel simpathy towards the americans, remembering the massive disaster of World Trade Center, and towards any innocent person from any country whose life is truncated when she or he is going to work, to shopping, to study, or whatever.
I am sure that american people, who suffered the september 11th tragedy just "yesterday", are feeling just as an own drama the bloody crime that happened in Madrid today.
Just read their messages, and think twice before talking. All of us feel the same rage, but we must use our brain, just to distinguih ourselves from those who use a bomb instead a brain.
Media are media. We have many unrepresentative media here in Spain, too, didn't you know?
People are people. When I read the messages of american people in this bbs, I read messages from people who are just like us.
And now, please, let's get back to the important thing. There is many people dying and suffering out there. We don't kow yet their names: maybe some of them are american, sice there are many foreigner people in Madrid. Did you think that?
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#64182 - 03/11/04 08:23 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 01/07/01
Posts: 91
Loc: US
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As I am reading the sad news my heart aches for the pain that others impose on humans. I dont understand why. I thank you Almohada for youre feelings RAW as there may be. I cannot understand Cristobo's mind. What is he talking about??? Simpathy on Americans??? We are mourning over people whos life got changed forever. How terrible this is FOR ALL OF US. It is not the number of people that have been killed it is the death of each and every one person that is tragic. My heart is sad
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#64183 - 03/11/04 08:36 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 01/25/01
Posts: 1235
Loc: Rockford, IL/Milton, WI, USA
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We too wait on word of loved ones who would have arrived in Atoche Renfe at about the time of the bombings. But it goes beyond that. Our hearts reach out to everyone who was killed or injured, regardless if we knew them or not.
This has to end. Innocents cannot continue to die at the hands of terrorists, and nobody doing anything effective to stop it. Nations and people have to unite in their efforts to make it stop. It's time that all political differences be set aside, and unity prevail. Let it start here by everyone understanding the enormity of what happened in Madrid, and supporting the people in their efforts to uncover the truth of this horrible tragedy. Let's also hope that whoever was behind this pays dearly for what they've done.
Wolf
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#64184 - 03/11/04 09:37 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 541
Loc: Texas
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i have been trying to get through to my close friend in madrid, with no success. am i correct to say that the trains were near atocha around 8am spain time??? thats about when one of my friends should have been arrriving there to switch to the metro and go to class, but im not sure exactly what train hed have been on, one of the cercanias coming from outside of madrid though. my thoughts are with everybody, il be praying. kelly
_________________________
"Ojos que no ven, corazón que no siente."
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#64185 - 03/11/04 09:43 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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Wow. Impressive. People are thankfully uniting in Puerta del Sol to give blood. See the photo below of the line of people waiting to pass through the mobile (bus) blood bank: I'm told by friends in Madrid that tomorrow (Friday) there will be gathering ("manifestación") at Atocha. You can likely watch through the Madrid traffic cams in the area.
_________________________
Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64186 - 03/11/04 09:44 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 136
Loc: Asturias
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Death toll so far, 186 people. But it is too probable that it will rise yet. Arnaldo Otegui, head of ETA`s political wing (currently illegal) has just rejected the attack. It is the first time EVER. I never thought I would see such a thing. Even those bastards can feel horrified! The whole world is supporting the suffering of the victims. It is something beautiful and moving, sort of a world brotherhood. I wrote my first post when I was still in shock after seeing the cynical reaction of CNN. Along this morning I have seen numberless shows of support from Americans and Brits. I see now that the flawed view of the media is not shared by people of good will. I am sorry if someone felt offended, just understand this is not the best morning to send a balanced post.
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#64187 - 03/11/04 09:59 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 01/25/01
Posts: 1235
Loc: Rockford, IL/Milton, WI, USA
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Cristobo,
Americans aren't as easily swayed by the media as people would imagine. We've always been free thinking, and most people don't realize how close we really are to the world community. What hurts Spain, and Spaniards, hurts us very deeply as well, because our roots, and our friends, are part of Spanish society, and world society. We care very deeply, even if the event doesn't directly affect us as individuals.
I can understand how the heat of the moment can make someone say something they don't mean. We all suffer from that happening at one time or another during our lives. But being able to own up to the error is the key to being understood, and you did that quite admirably. Thank you for seeing us for who we really are.
Wolf
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#64188 - 03/11/04 10:09 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 152
Loc: Madrid
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Cristobo, Unfortunately, the mass media's power to communicate ideas and common feeling is of the same level as its power to whip up hatred and suspicion. As many have have posted, we ALL have a responsibility to make sure that the true intent and goodwill shared by most people in this world remain head and shoulders above forces that would like nothing better than to see us at each other's throats.
Cheers to you for your mature response. I am sure we are one on this.
Best, A
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#64190 - 03/11/04 11:28 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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Jennita et. al., the Official page you seek is the Ministry of the Interior @ http://www.mir.es/atentadomadrid/atentado.htm . And, I'm quite amazed that already, just a few hours after the explosions, ALREADY have a list of names of the injured and the name of the hospital where they were sent @ http://www.mir.es/atentadomadrid/heridoshospitales.htm . My goodness. What a list.. I don't suspect they will release a list of those killed/murdered for some time.
_________________________
Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64191 - 03/11/04 11:38 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Junior Member
Registered: 03/11/04
Posts: 4
Loc: Salt Lake City, USA
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I have been a part-time lurker but felt compelled to register and post after hearing the horrible, sad news of this morning’s terrorist attacks. I immediately thought about my friends in the States now who are from Spain and have family members there and about those of you who have lived and are living in Madrid. I just wanted to say a couple things.
First, my heart aches for everyone living in Spain, especially Madrid, now. I’m sure you are experiencing similar feelings of shock, anger, fear, and sadness that we Americans did after 9/11. Because of that experience, I can sympathize and understand what you may be feeling. I don’t think the number of lives lost affects the power of the grief experienced in these situations. I can imagine the state of shock the people of Madrid will be in for the next several weeks and I am sending all my good thoughts and wishes to the people on this board who are struggling with the news.
I was a member of an email list of friends and acquaintances living in America and abroad during 9/11 and I’d like to offer this advice to the people here, from my experience: it is understandable and important that you talk about your feelings whether they are of sadness, anger, or blame. Everyone affected by this will go through stages of grief (which include anger) and we should be open to those discussions and not judgmental while each person works out his/her own feelings in trying to find logic in the senseless acts of murderers. That’s not to say there won’t be debate but I encourage you all to express your feelings and try not to judge too harshly the emotionally-charged words of people in pain. Instead of attacking and acting defensive, try to better understand what a person is really trying to express through his/her grief.
Peace be with you all.
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#64192 - 03/11/04 11:40 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/18/04
Posts: 18
Loc: Denver
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Thank you so much for the links! Luckily my friends are not on the injured list.
My heart goes out to everyone and their families and friends.
Jennita
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#64194 - 03/11/04 01:05 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Junior Member
Registered: 03/11/04
Posts: 1
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Greetings,
As an American of Spanish descent I would like send my support to all the people of Spain.
Ironically, I was in Spain on Sept. 11th when the attacks occurred in America. I remember Spaniards going out of their way to show their support for Americans and against terrorism.
If the terrorists do turn out to be the ETA (which is what I am hearing on TVE) then I hope all Americans will condemn the actions of the Basque terrorists. I personally will NEVER visit the Basque region until the killing stops. I know most basques are innocent of this; but, if their travel economy is hurt, maybe they will do more to help also.
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#64195 - 03/11/04 01:52 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 01/28/04
Posts: 148
Loc: Chicago
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Madridman,
I also was calling locating family members and lucky for me, all are safe and sound. I heard on Canal Sur that the trains with the most victims were from outlying neighborhoods that house a lot of laborers, lower-income people...Lots of immigrants from Poland, Romania...the kind of families that might never recover from this kind of thing.
It's so sad and if anyone can think of something we can do from our homes to help, donate to Red Cross or whatever, please share ideas.
MADRID, ANIMO, CHICAGO ESTA CONTIGO!
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#64196 - 03/11/04 01:57 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 42
Loc: Madrid
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"I can`t stand CNN hipocrisy on this subject. Believe me, this is not the best day to demand me for simpathy on Americans"
HELLO, since when did CNN become the spokesman for Americans?? CNN is a subsidiary of Time Warner which is owned by its company's shareholders, mainly the very liberal Ted Turner and large mutual fund companies and anyone else who buys the company's stock when the market is open.
You should start watching Fox News like most Amercians do. Fox New Channel has been killing CNN in the ratings for several years now and is in fact the most watched cable news channel.
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#64197 - 03/11/04 03:07 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 11/02/00
Posts: 193
Loc: BOSTON
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My heart goes out to all spaniards. I saw it on the spanish tv station here in the U.S. How fleeting life is. I remember spending quite a bit of time by atocha station when I lived in madrid last summer.All this amounts to is more unecessary bloodshed.When will people get tired of the killing. Killing in Iraq, Killing in Israel, Africa, Spain, when will it end?
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#64198 - 03/11/04 04:44 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/30/04
Posts: 8
Loc: New York, USA
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Again as I posted on the travel warning page, my heart goes out to everyone effected by these senseless attacks on innocent people. But my hair just bristles when I read the comments by DCS. CNN, or FOX they are both owned by large corporate interests, take your pick. If you think you are receiving unbiased reporting, you need a reality check. I for one, am greatful there are message boards like this one, where people can communicate directly to each other and bypass the propaganda machines. Stay strong, and blessings.
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#64199 - 03/11/04 05:02 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 42
Loc: Madrid
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NYCritter, I was stating that the perception that CNN is run by the U.S. Gov is false. Of course Fox News is part of a large corporation(NewsCorp). The point is, we have more choices than CNN and I believe in fact that you get more realisitc reporting from Fox News or even MSNBC or even CNBC. I would suggest with all due respect that perhaps I'm not the one who needs a reality check.
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#64200 - 03/11/04 09:19 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Junior Member
Registered: 03/11/04
Posts: 1
Loc: seattle usa
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My in-laws will be coming to the states next week. Being a member of the PSOE I'm sure he'll give me an ear-full about this.
I can sympathize though...Spain's awesome support of the USA after Sept.11 has resulted in them paying a heavy price.
My heart goes out to all the grieving families tonight.
Madrid!
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#64201 - 03/11/04 10:16 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Junior Member
Registered: 03/06/04
Posts: 11
Loc: california
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Hello to all, I'm sorry to write my first message on such a terrible and shocking day. I've been a lurker here for a while, enjoying all your posts while planning my first trip to Spain (coming up at the end of April). But I have to write today just to express my deep sorrow and horror for the events in Madrid today. I found out about the bombings from my travel agent, who called to tell me my ticket is ready to pick up, which should have been such happy news, rather than horrible and sad and scary as today's events have been.
MadridMan, I have read so many of your posts and journals talking about how much you love the city and consider it your heart's home. I feel such sympathy and sorrow for you, and for the Spaniards and other lovers of Spain who are on this message board. May we all know peace on earth someday, when the human race may evolve beyond such senseless violence and hatred. My prayers and love go out to you all on this terrible day.
Martha
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#64202 - 03/12/04 09:25 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 07/05/01
Posts: 1551
Loc: Madrid, Spain
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Let's not choose the wrong enemies: Only terrorists are to blame of this blood bath.
In Bali 200 persons were killed, and Bali didn't support US actions against Iraq.
Terrorists, no matter if it was ETA or Al-Qaeda, will try to kill anywhere, elsewhere if they are given the chance, no matter what we do or stop doing.
We should make every possible effort to make them end in prison forever.
Fernando
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#64203 - 03/12/04 10:22 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 152
Loc: Madrid
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Fernando, I could not agree with you more. In these times, it is so important to remain focused and to be able to differentiate friend from foe. Two countries trying to their best for their people will always have differences of opinion, with some greater than others. However, when a third party inflicts such pain on the innocents of both sides, PLEASE maintain perspective on our differences. They are trivial and manageable compared to our collective need to root out this evil, this virus that wants nothing more than to see us turn against each other.
One need only look at the relationship between the US and France. So much potential love, yet so and much shameful behavior public posturing. Folks, there is so, so much more to bind us together. Let's focus on the 99.9% of common pursuits and raise a glass of vinto tinto to the other .01%. At the same time, let's put 110% of our minds and souls into destroying this nasty cancer that threatens us all.
When I leave Spain, I for one, will do all I can to focus on the positive, even if all I can do is buy more manchego and ribera del duero. And I hope that every once in a while, my Spainish friends lay down a few $$ for a pair of Levi's. Of course it is not about money, but just one example of how us little folks can pitch in to cement ties...
Never have I been on a more mature and caring board. Let's all do our best to maintain the love.
Peace, A
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#64204 - 03/12/04 10:37 AM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 07/05/01
Posts: 1551
Loc: Madrid, Spain
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Thanks almohada.
These are sad times.
We have received so much support from abroad that we can only be grateful for having so many friends around the world.
Fernando
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#64205 - 03/12/04 03:04 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 03/12/04
Posts: 81
Loc: Augusta, Georgia
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Cristobo Carrín's response was a kneejerk response and one that we have all made in the past. His anger got ahold of him as it has me, many, many times. As far as CNN, they are known to be controlled by the leftist media in the states and would so anything, in my opinion, to discredit the coalition of the willing's war on terror,to include marginalizing the tragic event that happened in Madrid and distance it from the attackers of 9/11. It is my opinion that this was caused by Al Queda and that complacency isn't an option at this time. You guys have a right to be angry at CNN and my heart and prayers go out to you guys. Now, I am known to be a hothead when it comes to politics, etc. (Can't have too many heavy objects near me when I am watching the news, if you know what I mean) and when I heard that Al Queda IDIOT in London try to deny responsibility because, "Al Queda doesn't target innocent civilians" .....I wanted to throw the TV out the window.
The only thing we, as nations of free people, can do is turn into the attackers. The day of proaction is here and reaction is no longer an option. We can no longer stand idly by and wait for something to happen. Innocent civilians are being targeted. These people do not distinguish between combatants and non-combatants. They hate us all.
GOD bless all freedom-loving people,
Kevin
_________________________
"Neither the United States of America nor the world community of nations can tolerate deliberate deception and offensive threats on the part of any nation, large or small. We no longer live in a world where only the actual firing of weapons represents a sufficient challenge to a nation's security" -- President John F. Kennedy during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
"Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty." -- President John F. Kennedy
Democrats, why the change?
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#64206 - 03/12/04 03:58 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 12/21/01
Posts: 87
Loc: N. Redondo Beach, CA
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Me toca a mí. FOX NEWS Suck!!! (All mainstream cable/network media outlets do) Anyone who thinks that it's truly 'fair and balanced' has the I.Q. of a 60 watt bulb. More Americans watch it than any other news program because it's so unabashedly pro-american and they don't question what they hear anyway. It tells most viewers what they want to hear and makes them feel good SO THAT THEY STAY TUNED AND WATCH THE COMMERCIALS (this is the basis of television - advertisers pay $$$ for the exposure, networks run things that will get those viewers to watch - no commercials, no T.V. shows) instead of actually reporting the reality of the situation. They are self proclaimed conservatives - and very poor journalist. And the flag in the backround is chillingly Big Brotherish - like watching 'state T.V.' If you watched a news program in Iraq or Russia for example, constantly waiving their flag in the backround, you would question their objectivity too. And yeah, boy, CNN is sooooo liberal. All those stock holders worried about quarterly dividends and CEOs in charge of programming to keep advertisers happy are all really closet hippies. They're about as liberal as the pope is protestant.
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#64207 - 03/12/04 04:13 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Member
Registered: 03/12/04
Posts: 81
Loc: Augusta, Georgia
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Since when is loving one's country "big brotherish"? I think anytime you see something happen to a people, they put their differences aside and become binded by the one thing that can bring them together...that they are all countrymen. ...and if you don't think CNN is left-leaning from hell, well, that's a telling sign of how you believe. You think you are centrist, as most liberals do, and anything to the right of you you consider far right. How wrong you are. I am a Libertarian and feel that people like you AND right-wing fanatics are bad for ANY country. Tell me, are you opposed to how we are handling the war on terror? If so, tell us, oh wise one, how would you have handled it when you had no support from many of your allies. I'll give you time to consult with your "liberal politicos" as to what you would have done and how you feel Spain should address this issue. IMO, liberals never have answers as to how to defend their country. They want to hold hands and sing Kum-Bay-Ya with the rest of the world. Guess what, much of the world wants you dead. Then what?
With that said, this is neither the time nor the place to start a political bashing session.
_________________________
"Neither the United States of America nor the world community of nations can tolerate deliberate deception and offensive threats on the part of any nation, large or small. We no longer live in a world where only the actual firing of weapons represents a sufficient challenge to a nation's security" -- President John F. Kennedy during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
"Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty." -- President John F. Kennedy
Democrats, why the change?
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#64208 - 03/12/04 08:54 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 152
Loc: Madrid
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Kevin, You have restored my faith that thinkers still exist.
Thank you.
Gosh, for many of us, when the Stars and Stripes wave, the feeling is NOT of nationalism, but of pure and unadultered freedom. Those yahoos who scream USA! USA! at sporting events but then go and break every serious responsibility that goes along with freedom are american with a small "A."
Rocinante, I trust that your beef is with those americans with the small "A." I hope so. Because if it is with Americans, the kind that Kevin is saluting, then you are missing the big picture. In these times, you MUST be able to distinguish between the two. If you truly believe in freedom, you will welcome Americans. If you want to play politics, and consider all of the USA to be in bed with Fox or CNN sans rational and realistic thinking, then you are no better than the yahoo or the eltist hypocrites we see with increasing regularity in the US.
So when the US offers to help with the investigation or coordinates with Aznar on anti-terrorist tactics, you have your choice. Treat this gesture as an american gesture--for which your ego and God knows whatelse boils to the top--or you can treat it as an American gesture, one that is borne out of genuine empathy and commonality of spirit.
It's your choice.
A...for American and damn proud to be one.
Viva España!!! Viva la libertad!!
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#64209 - 03/12/04 09:50 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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Kevin wrote: With that said, this is neither the time nor the place to start a political bashing session. I'm in total agreement, Kevin. Keep the faith, my brother. We're here to unite and support Madrid and Spain. Please try to keep cool heads while discussing this very very passionate and sad event. Thank you. Saludos, MadridMan
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Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64210 - 03/12/04 10:23 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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A list of names of those mortally injured (the dead) can be found on the ABC.es site HERE .
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Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64211 - 03/12/04 10:28 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 02/04/04
Posts: 130
Loc: Seattle, WA USA
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MadridMan- It is a little difficult to "keep a cool head" when several of the posters continues to liberal-bait. In not so many words, Kevin and others have accused those with liberal political beliefs of being unpatriotic and supporting terrorism, among other things. I would say some of the posts insinuated that liberals are sympathetic to this horrible massacre. I find it ironic that Kevin continues to bash people of other political persuasions and then says: With that said, this is neither the time nor the place to start a political bashing session. This from the man who said (referring to Rocinante's post) I am a Libertarian and feel that people like you AND right-wing fanatics are bad for ANY country I held my tongue after reading numerous previous posts, but I can do so no longer. Read the definition of loyal opposition. Please back off on the political rhetoric. For the record, I have read the CNN site and have seen ETA referred to as a terrorist organization, as a separatist organization that is on the US terrorist list, and as a separatist organization. We are all adults and capable of evaluating for ourselves how slanted (or not) a news organization's coverage is... Saludos, V
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#64212 - 03/12/04 10:43 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Executive Member
Registered: 05/06/00
Posts: 9080
Loc: Madrid, Spain (was Columbus, O...
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Well said. Let's all agree to disagree. ¿Vale? It is true that it's EXTREMELY difficult to keep a cool head in this situation but let's try to (or at least not to lash out and ) respect one another's opinions and not impose our own individual beliefs as the one and only correct one. Lest ye not forget the Spanish Inquisition.
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Visit BarcelonaMan.com for Barcelona information, Transportation, Lodging, & much MUCH more! Curious about what could POSSIBLY be inside the brain of MadridMan? Visit MadridMan's Madrid Blog
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#64213 - 03/12/04 11:20 PM
Re: Madrid: Separatist group ETA conquers again
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Full Member
Registered: 01/10/04
Posts: 152
Loc: Madrid
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I think we are doing a pretty good job given the circumstances...Venting has not been done in bad taste by any stretch of the imagination...I just read the thread on immigration...Yikes, MM. Things got NASTY.
God bless every one. An extra hug to your amor en donde que se encuentra...
'night!
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