Here it comes.... the Euro!!!!

Starting today December 15th, banks in Spain have started to sell small Euro coins packages so that people can get familiar with them. These "packages" consist of a 43 coins summing 2000 pesetas (12.02 euros).

Note that although saving's banks are closed on Saturdays, banks are opened during the morning.

For those of you interested in what are they look like, have a look at the official site . There you'll see the design of the Euro banknotes and the Euro coins .

There is something maybe you don't know about the Euro coins.



By the way, although today is not the official start of the Euro, I'll remember it anyway because it's also my birthday

[ 12-14-2001: Message edited by: MadridMan ]

Happy Birthday, Antonio! May your wishes come true.

Wolf

A historic moment - moving towards one economic system.

My roommate who is from Madrid (via Asturias) said she's heard reports of stores taking advantage of the "change-over." Nothing criminal or too devious, but "padding" (slightly increasing) the new converted amounts on some goods.

Is this true, or widespread?

I'm also interested in the culture aspects. Spain has such a strong national identity - is there any regret on loosing the Peseta?

All commerces are doing it in fact :-(

Example if something would cost 5,43 € they don't hesitate to round it to 5,5€ or more. Thus, there are small things which are going to rise their prices up to 60% (think of something that costs 5 ptas, they will charge you 5 euro cents). This is going to be very bad to the inflaction (is that the word?).

I think that noone regrets loosing the peseta. Yes, it is a pitty since it has been our beloved peseta for centuries, but what the hell, the euro have some great advantages. Today I tried to get some euros, but the bank clerk didn't want to give them yet Of course I have complaint to him for it. Maybe on monday...

Fernando

That's true. Although the government is saying all the time the Euro will only mean a currency change but nothing else, it's true that some people are taking advantage of it to round their prices.

You can see how politicians lie when they ask people not to rise their prices and they decide to increase the Metrobús (ten trips ticket for subway and buses) by more than 9% so that the new price is 5 euros.

As for the national identity, patriotism is not as strong as in the USA but there are people who regret it and others - like me - who thinks it's going to be a great thing for the European economy.

Just think how much money European companies are loosing just due to the commission they pay when exchanging money among the different currencies. And the money European tourists will save (they don't have to exchange money) or even non-European tourists who will be able to exchange their money once and travel all around the 12 countries who have joined the Euro.

Antonio, muchas felicidades.

I do agree with Antonio and Fernando. I don’t think spain has such a strong national identity and most of the people don’t regret on loosing the Peseta if this is on behalf of our economy system and I think that having the euro will gave us more economy estability and other benefits.

The worse of all will be the first few months in which we will have to live with two different currencies in our pockets and we will have to use the calculator a lot. Also it won’t be easy to deal with cents, as we are not used to them. In any case, I hope we will forgot all this in a short time period.

You didn't manage to get Euros today?. Uhm... I guess you were not perseverant enough. I went this morning to the nearest bank BBVA but they told me they will start on Monday. Then, I went to a Santander Central Hispano branch and I did get my Euros!!!.

Yes I was perseverant!

These are the banks in which I searched:
-Caixa Galicia: closed
-Barclays Bank: closed
-Ibercaja: closed
-Banco Atlántico: closed
-BBVA: closed
-Bankinter: closed
-BSCH: at leat one opened! I get in: "sorry, we don't have euros yet, we just received 7 bags" (that is false, they have to have by law at least one for each customer).
-Another BBVA: opened! 20 minutes in a row and then they tell me that they only give euros to their customers! bastards! :P what if I don't have an account in any bank? I can't have the national currency?

Grrrr, this bank staff are sooooooo stupid... (I told them that I could just open an account, take my euros and then close the account, and all would be acording their rules).

Fernando

Spaniards,

If I bring Euro denominated travler's cheques at the end of December into Spain, will merchants except them before January 1. I am sure this has already been asked and answered, but I couldn't find the previous query.

Mil Gracias,
Shawn

P.S. Happy Birthday Pim! Your additions to the board have been tremendous. I hope your party was fantastic.

P.S. Nicole did you just celebrate a B-day as well? May your year be full of "champagne wishes and caviar dreams"

Shawn, I can't think of any reason for not accepting them. We already have bills in euros for example.

It's my opinion...

Fernando

Wow, those brits really hate the Euro, check out this link. Is the Euro a rash move?
They claim that the coins due to their metalic content are more likely to cause a rash due to handling than most coins! There isn't any direct research, only some sort of experiment with human sweat.

As for being an American the Euro will be very convenient. Its so close to the dollar that its practically 1 to 1. I think I may be more used to it when I go to Spain on January 17 than a few Spaniards!

Hehe, but it makes you wonder, what's going to happen to those beauro de cambio shops everywhere. They are going to loose a lot of business it seems. What will they trade now Pounds Dollars and Euros? Well, it serves them right for hosing people on the rates since the beginning of time.

Michael don't make much credibility to those news...

UK has always been anti-european (as a supranational concept). It is an historic attitude of isolationism and looking to the US instead of looking towards Europe. It has worked very well for them for centuries.

It is my opinion, but I think that in this matter they have all to loose if they don't subscribe themselves to the euro. They will be caught between two powerful currencies.

Anyway, even if they accept it, they don't need to like it.

Maybe someone of the british members here could argue a little further.

Fernando

As always , Fernando likes to "stir the pot." Love it - makes life around here much more interesting! It's amazing how uppity the British can be. In this case towards the Euro. Having the strong pound won't be so attractive when they try to export to the European continent. Who do YOU think will get the last laugh...

It's facinating to read European coments regarding the British. If I may stir the pot a little more, and engage in a little FRIENDLY Brit-bashing (please note: my roots include British)...

Sounds like these Brits are a little two-faced. I found it interesting Fernando writes that Britian looks to the U.S., and NOT to Europe. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised, but then again many Brits can be o' so snooty to us Americans (yes, I know this is not always the case, but...!).

Don't get me wrong, Americans do look toward England with respect - like Mexico looks towards Spain (our mother-countries), but man o' man are Brits arrogant to us Americans.

I can never leave Europe with out some gent from England telling me he "wouldn't mind that we would need to speak American, and not English!" I'm always polite, and smile, but behind their backs I laugh. Like Latin America speaks Spanish, Americans speak English!!!

Maybe because the sun now DOES set on the British Empire they have to look towards America...just a thought.

... ... ...
(Please, please, let's not turn this into a bash Britain thread - this was in "good-fun," even if there is some truth to their arrogance. Americans are very grateful they were the first country to stand by us after the attacks.)

[ 12-16-2001: Message edited by: JJP ]

I sure hope some British, I know we have some, would like to defend themselves...

I just read an article in El Mundo today about price rounding- it seems the real estate market is seeing it in large sums of pesetas.

Hello, just to respond to a few of the points put forward re. the UK, I do think Britain has quite a few people who do not like Europe... as Maggie Thatcher once said.."All our problems have come from Europe and all the solutions from English speaking countries." Also some people here are afraid of having their way of life dictated by Brussels and who see European regulations as the erosion of British sovereignty by the EU. However, the UK has been a full member of the EU since 1973 and wasn't Winston Churchill an early Euro enthusiast? Also thousands of Brits visit France, Spain, Italy, Greece etc every year and love those countries so not everyone can hate Europe. I dont think that, for better or worse, the UK can be called isolationist...after all the British Empire spanned the globe and we now have millions of Asian and Caribbean people living here not to mention the EU citizens. I do not think that anyone under the age of sixty seriously laments the demise of the empire... if they do, they'd be thought of as pretty sad! As for the British being arrogant towards Americans, there are probably quite a few Brits who are but they would be arrogant towards anyone who wasn't English and are definitely worth avoiding at all costs!

Shawn,

I thought only banks took traveller checks and you had to cash them to pay anywhere else.

For any transaction that doesn't need cash, you can use the Euro. However, cash can't be used until January 1st 2002. That is, if you go to a bank to cash your traveller checks, you'll get pesetas until January 1st. After that day, they'll give you Euros.

Maybe someone can answer a question for me: In October I exchanged all my peseta notes for Irish Punths which I proceeded to spend, mostly on pints of Guinness, etc. It was in anticipation of the Euro conversion. I will be in Spain around 5 February. I have a couple of mil worth of coins: 500, 200 and 100 peseta (which they wouldn't take where I exchanged my peseta banknotes). Will I be able to spend those coins or exchange them for Euro coins when in Spain for Carnaval (5 Feb - 14 Feb)? Will I have to take them to a bank?
muchas gracias de antemano

From the 1st of January to the 28th of February every commerce has to accept pesetas (but they will give you back euros).

From the 1st of March to the 30th of June you can only use euros, but your pesetas (or any other european currency) could be changed in banks. From the 1st of July ahead you can only change pesetas in the Spanish Central Bank (Banco de España).

Bricamb, in fact Britain has been very isolianist historicly. Nowadays this is changing, but british normally view us as no more than africans who live in the region in which they take holidays... I've been insulted more than once for being spaniard in my own country by british. It's a pitty I speak english... I could understand their insults, but they couldn't understand mine...

Of course this is a generalization. There are thousands of british who come to Spain to drink until they are in coma, but many others apreciate our culture and respect us.

Do you know that in some beach places there are english pubs in which spaniards can't enter? or that in Mallorca there are places in which all the texts, prices and so on are in german marks? This is quite disgutsting

Anyway, if not for the tourism that comes from Europe (mainly) Spain would be a much poorer country than we are. So we should be more than grateful. It is just a pitty that the tourists only want a place with sun and in which they can drink and eat the same than in their countries, instead of trying to understand and know another different culture.

For me, this attitude is like if when I went to London I would have search for a spanish restaurant to eat... No way! Me and my family tried to watch, see and experience all what is left of the english culture (now London is anything but english...).

It's just my opinion I don't want to "stir the pot" as JJP says, only express my points of view with all due respect.

Fernando

Hey Shawn. I did just have a birthday, the 6th. I turned 29.

I have to admit that I feel sad to say goodbye the the peseta, and other European currencies, but hopefully it will be positive for you.

Thanks Fernando for the info on the peseta to Euro changeover period. According to it I'll spend my pesetas on chocolate & churros when I get there in early February.

As for 'Brit' bashing: In Torremolinos one year we stopped for a coffee on the way to the beach. The 'counter' people couldn't understand me when I ordered dos cortados. I finally had to revert to English and ask for two coffees, cream & sugar. But it's not just the 'Brits.'

The same thing happened to me more recently in Benidorm. We stopped in a German restaurant and tried to order in Spanish. The waiters couldn't understand us. They didn't know English either, so being very hungry, I had to rely on my two semesters of college German from many years ago.

Maybe it's because of the EU; but it's a shame when a Spanish person can't expect to be understood in a restaurant in his/her own country. And I'm not referring to Euskera or Galego or Catalan: I never encountered a problem in Galicia or Basque Country or Catalunia with people not understanding castellano.

Maybe this thread is morphing into a discussion on "culture-importation" ???

Thanks everyone for the Euro-info. I leave in two days for Madrid, and can't wait to see the new coins. Anybody post when the bills are being released? I should go back to that link Antonio provided.

... ... ...

PS: I think the great moral to the subtext of this thread is this: It is a shame when people pay a thousand+$ (for Americans) to travel to Spain (or where-ever) only to bring their culture with them! Shameful! Isn't the purpose of traveling to experience another culture!?!?!? Well, on a happy note, I guess I'm a little relieved it's not just tourits from the U.S. that are so irresponsible. Sounds like the Germans and British are no better than the average American in how they experience a foreign country...what a pity.

Bricamb,

Thank you for your most rational response to my attempt to elicit a response from the British.

As a citizen of the U.S., I feel that I visit every country (in Latin America, Africa, or Europe - doesn't matter) with the burden of being an "American." We have such a nasty reputation, I enjoy showing other cultures we don't all deserve this "bad-rap"!

As for my comments on a "American" dialect. Well, technically it's true. We do have a different accent. Also, the British - on average - handle the language with much more grace than the average American. Many times, I think, an average American views the British as uppity because they have a better vocabulary along with a "funny" sound (as some of my less cultured fellow countrymen would say - "funny how they talk").

The problem, however, is that I don't like stereotypes, and I simply resent the arrogance directed to "Americans" by many in Britain AND Europe. We are a vastly diverse nation, and not all of us embody what disgusts EU people. We don't all own a gun FOR PROTECTION (nothing wrong with hunting!), drive a SUV, over-consume everything, and say "'like' this..." or "'like' that..." So whenever someone says, "OK, I'll speak American with you" I just simply think they have either never visited my country or they are just jealous and nasty. You're right: the best defense is to avoid these people.

Hmmm...I guess this email is way off target of the thread. Just wanted to thank Bricamb for a rational response to my provacative post - we have great people in this community!

Have you checked if you computer is Euro-ready?. Are you able to type/see the Euro symbol?. Since most of you are using Microsoft Windows as the operating system, check out Microsoft's website for information about how to update your system.

From what I've read, if you are using Microsoft Windows 98 Second Edition or above, then, your operating system is Euro ready. If you are using Microsoft Office 2000 or above, again you won't have any problems. If not, you can download specific updates for your systems.

Don't forget to check any other software you are using.

By the way, it seems that European (or at least Spanish keyboards) have the Euro symbol at the letter "e" and you get it by pressing Alt Gr + e. However, I've read americans keyboards need a different combination to get the Euro symbol.

On my standard US keyboard while running Windows , € ,the Euro symbol, can be generated by holding down the Alt key while entering 0128 on the right number pad.

On my standard Spanish keyboard you can get the Euro symbol by typing the following combinations:

Alt + 0128 (like American keyboards)

or

Alt Gr + e

or

Alt Gr + 5

Get EURO ready!!

I'm down to 1 solitary 100 pta coin. I think I will keep it as a souvenir.

Here's a couple articles from my old town's newspaper (registration is free):
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/12/28/international/europe/28PESE.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/12/28/international/europe/28CURR.html

During one of my first days in Madrid (December 23rd, maybe), one of my ladyfriend's friends brought over one of the bags of EURO coins which all can/could get from their banks as a kind of introduction to the new coins (only coins and ONLY 1 bag per customer at their respective banks). Imagine the two older ladies (my ladyfriend's mother is 78 years old and her aunt is 72) with their poor eyesight trying to distinguish the different coins, particularly the smaller copper ones. Those poor people. But, with time, I suppose things will get better (or worse) for them as time goes on.

During my time in Spain (December 22 - January 2), THE HOT TOPIC on EVERYONE'S lips was, of course, THE EURO.

January 1st came and 3 of us drove to Segovia for a walk around town and to have a GREAT lunch at Duque (impressive website! A review will come soon to the "Food, Drink, & Entertainment" forum). On the way, we passed through the Toll Gate. My ladyfriend paid in pesetas and the attendant gave us EUROS in change!!! WOO HOO! Our/my first Euros!! I "bought" ALL these Euros, from my ladyfriend as souvenirs of "The First Euros From Europe" (at least for me).

At Duque, the bill was totally listed in EUROS (I paid with a credit card -- $$$$ YIKES! That was expensive, but oh-so gooood!). After a stroll through Segovia and before leaving, we stopped into a real coffee shop (only served coffees and teas) and EVERYONE around us was chatting about the Euro and how they weren't comfortable that the change they were receiving was accurate because it was impossible to calculate "in the moment" if paying in pesetas and getting Euros as change.

So, I have a few EUROS and brought back as many assorted peseta coins and a few bills as historical souvenirs too. I'll miss the peseta for sure.

Certainly, as soon as everyone has spent all their last remaining pesetas and are using Euros as payment and then getting back Euros as change, it will be easier. Good luck, Euro!

Sadly, MadridMan

Just a quick question for the Spaniards on the board (or anyone else who knows)...how are Spanish people pronouncing the word "euro"? "Eh-oor-oh"? "Yoo-ro"? The first seems more likely to me, given what I know of Spanish pronounciation, but maybe not? And are there euro-related nicknames for money yet? (Like "duro" for 5 pesetas?)

I don't want to sound silly on my next trip to España!!

Buena suerte, euro!

Pero te echo de menos, peseta!

I have a few 100-peseta coins tucked away too, as souvenirs. I always loved those coins...nice and heavy, and a good size. Does anyone have a link for a site that compares the sizes and colors of the euro coins with the old peseta ones? Coins are always trickier for me to learn when traveling than bills.

Tara

I have also my euros by now, both notes and coins

My first impression with the coins is that they were tiny compared to the pesetas, and less heavy. With the notes my impression was that they were very thin compared to the pesetas. However, I think the euros are quite good looking

The word "euro" is not pronounced as in english here, we pronounce as "Europa" in spanish "Eh-oor-oh" as you said taravb (we don't see it as a forgein word, it is familiar to us). Also, we don't call the cents "cents" but "centimos". I'm not sure if this will last, perhaps in the future we will call them cents (pronounced in the spanish way of course).

"And are there euro-related nicknames for money yet? (Like "duro" for 5 pesetas?)"

Not yet, but I'm sure they will be, and some of the pesetas nicknames will surely still be used. Historicly we have been very imaginative putting nicknames to the peseta (rubia, pela, duro for the 5 pesetas coin, etc). For example, I call by now the 5 cents coin a "duro"

In the MM party I was asked (by Shawn) if we are not sad of seeing the peseta going. For sure! But keep in mind that we don't see her like in other countries as something with a patriotic or soberan value. More than disgust what we have is the pittiness of loosing it. But we (overall) see the advantages of the euro, and welcome it. We are a very touristic country and the euro is just great for tourism.

I think that the only problem is the adaptation we have to suffer. 1 euro is 166.386 pesetas so it is very hard for old people to convert it instanctly without a calculator (althought there are simple rules as 3 euros=500 pesetas).

Fernando

Taravb,
Regarding the Euro pronunciation. I can understand your confusion. I have been here for several days now, and I still struggle with that dipthong that begins the word. I hear it non-stop, as MM said it is on the lips of nearly evryone, yet I still botch this important four letter word with reckless abandond .

[ 01-05-2002: Message edited by: Shawn ]

I think the conversion, while well received in general by the Spaniards, is tough for both the older folks as well as us Americans here who are still grappling with the metric system (me! :)) I am just beginning to learn what fair/reasonable prices are in pesetas for various groceries. Now with the conversion to the Euro, the redondeos (practice of unfairly rounding prices up to have a "pretty psychological price in Euros") as well as the quick metric math, I really am going bonkers!! However, I think it´s a really cool time in world history to be here in Europe,...especially SPAIN!!!

P.S. Madridman, how dare you go to Segovia and not even swing through El Espinar to say hola!!

[ 01-05-2002: Message edited by: Chica ]

I bought a cd for my last Finnish notes at Helsinki Airport on the New Years Day and received a 5 Euro note and some glittery coins in change. The coins look like the markers in roulette or counterfeit but the note is beautiful. It´s quite small though. I´ll save that money as souvenirs - or at least till october when I plan to visit Spain next time . I also have a 25 ptas and a 1 peseta coin in my "memory box" (till death us apart).


In Sweden we still have our own currency, the crown. For me personally it would naturally be better if Sweden started to use the Euro, because it would facilitate SO MUCH comparing prices and travelling, but for the Swedish economy there are some disadvantages. During a slowdown in business activities the own currency is an important and effective implement to reduce the consequences.

[ 01-05-2002: Message edited by: Tia ]

What do you think the Euro will do for the Spanish economy?

At dinner on Christmas Eve, my friend's mother - who was hosting the dinner - told me passionately that the Euro will not raise Spain to the level of France or Germany.

She is no economist, but a Madrileña with a fear that Spain will be hurt by the Euro!?! Is this a well founded fear, or one common among those in their sixties???

Thanks for the discussion...

To start with I should say that I´m not the type of person you describe above (the lady in her sixties). I consider myself openminded and adaptable... and I´m younger .

After reading some information about pros and cons of the Euro in different folders and newspapers I have to the best of my abiliby as a non-economist drawn my own conclusions. The disadvantages poise up.

I really don´t think that the common currency will ruin the Spanish economy, but the country will be more influenced by the decisions in Brussels, the Central Banks in the most powerful Europian countries (or whereever in the EMU they are made) than the Spanish government or other Spanish authorities/interests. I do disagree with the centralizacion and concentration of power.

Hi Tia,

Hopefully, you didn't think I was comparing you to my friend's sixty year-old mother. I should have posted in a more general way . If you had, you sure managed to find some humor in the possibility .

It's refreshing to hear the other side of the argument - the Euro concerns. Sounds like the non-Euro countries are more concerned with the (??) centralization of power.

This is also the reason the US government has no interest in answering to an international court system. I think all proud nations have a problem with loosing sovereign control. For this reason, I have immense respect for the current Euro-nations. They all have strong, separate cultural identities, but have a unified economic vision - let's hope it works!

Tia, thanks for giving this thread another dimension.

As a Brit I am very, very happy that we are adopting a "wait & see" policy with regards to the Euro (even though we'll go in anyway if Labour win the next election).
The benefits are obvious but, at the same time, it is such a massive gamble. We are lucky enough to have had a very stable and successful economy (well, most of the time anyway!) and that has been down to it being managed HERE in Britain. Yes, we have a lot less in common with our European neighbours than they do with each other, eg Spain with Italy, culturally (our LACK of it!), socially and economically. Because of this it is more important to us than it maybe is with other European nations that we are able to make and implement our own economic policy, rather than have a German banker in Frankfurt doing it for us.
Someone made the point that we tend to look to the US moreso than Europe. This holds a lot of truth and if we had to enter into monetary union with anyone, i'd be much more comfortable doing so with the US than with the rest of Europe as we share similar capitalistic (is that a word?!) values, whereas most European nations tend to have a more Socialist outlook.
Although there's alot more wrong with our country (I could go on for hours!) than there is with the majority of Europe, we are doing very well financially - if it isn't broke don't fix it!

With regards to places like Torremellinos which have been taken over by us and the Germans, I hate those kind of places aswell. What's the point???
I can, however, appreciate that not everybody is as adventurous as me and, I imagine, most of the other members here, and they find comfort in the familiar. Isn't it great that they can experience the familiar in such tropical conditions? The likes of us don't have to go there! And besides, the Spaniards in these areas do very well from mass tourism (as do the British & Germans).Would they want to kick all the Brits and Germans out and close all the bars, restaurants and nightclubs that put so much food on their tables and pesetas...sorry, Euro's!...in their pockets??
Like every affluent nation, we have our share of lowlife. American lowlives probably can't afford to travel all the way to Torremelinos, therefore, they're not in evidence. I imagine there are similar places that the cultured American would avoid just as the cultured Brit avoids the Costa del Sol and the Canary Islands (???).

Anyway, I'm no economist, but I am not comfortable with the UK adopting a fledgling currency. Five years from now - who knows?!
I probably won't have any choice in the matter anyway.

An interesting (or sad - depending on perspective) fact of the powerful U.S. economy (and thus - in some ways - the dollar's stability) is our culture's STONG "consumer" habits. We joke that: "...we should just 'buy' our way out of a recession..." But, the punchline is that our (and my) consumerism does keep us economically strong, and the dollar stable.

With this said, anyone have any comments on how such culturally different nations, with different habits and beliefs, might push/pull the Euro????

Or, is it a safe bet that bankers can rule the course of the Euro - doesn't culture play a part...?

Just a few unofficial questions - I'm certainly no economist here...

notyor,

You know, I have heard a lot of brits expressing desire of joining the dollar rather than the euro! Also I have heard lots of you expressing how you would rather be a 51st state than be in the euro! Are you guys hinting at something?

Hehe, all kidding aside, I have seen that opinion on the web a lot. Kinda funny huh.

I wouldn't WANT to go into monetary union with the US, I'm just saying that, given the choice, in certain ways it makes more sense than adopting the Euro.

After hearing from two of the three EU counties without the Euro here is a comment from the last one. Denmark.
I must say that i envy you guys inside.
Denmark still have to comply with all the rules of the game but without the benefits of the Euro. The exchange rates have been fixed for a long time.
And yes Tia we have problems with the power centralized in Brussels. Danes are affraid of this too. But we will join before long.
It no fun looking at a party that you have paid for but you can't join.
Before long we will all have forgot the Pesetas etc.

I always read the "Travel" section of our Sunday paper, and never miss a quick glance at the "Exchange Rates" column (to check on the peseta...of course!). This past week, it was strange to open the paper and see a list of euros, with only the occasional yen or pound thrown in (they list by country)!!

Tara

JJP,

I understood very well what you ment with the comment about your friend´s mother! It only made me smile, that´s all.

Btw I´m not sure that the welcoming of the Euro is a question of age. The elder people have a head on their shoulders and many times they are even brilliantly skilled in mental arithmetic - compared with the teenagers with their calculators.

Tia

Time to jump in.
I have a few inside sources in the Bush administration. They have continually told me over the past year that Aznar and Spain's elite are betting not on the Euro but in the expansion of NAFTA. The long term advantages of the European Union and its impending expansion will rest solidly in the hands of the Germans and the French. Remember, europe is going east of which Aznar and Spain have no interest in; quite the contrary.
Therefore, the future expansion of the Spanish economy resides in a unified Latin America. This is something that Aznar, Bush, and Fox have been working on feverishly. Even with the current problems in Argentina, Latin America still proves itself as a great market for Spain and its future. The US exports more products to Mexico than any other country in the world and Spain is the second largest investor in Latin America next to the US.
Granted, Spain needed to join the eu to speed its economical recovery. However, a partnership in a greater NAFTA is in Spain's long term financial interest with or even without the eu.

Would be a logical step to join NAFTA's "free" access in not only Mexico, but also the US and Canada. The talk of Spain's reconquest of the Americas is based in rhetoric, but a look at the last five years shows they are on a acquisition binge in Latin America. Let's see what happens - will be intriguing to watch what reaction is generated in the EU if (when) Spain joins...
. . .

What great, intimate information from inside the White House - interesting!

One might wonder what these - NAFTA entrance - types of pressures may cause inside the EU, and the effect on the Euro.



Could the focus on "latin" trade by Spain, and all the separate "agendas" amongst the EU members, negatively influence the Euro's stability?

No one will probably know for sure until all's in full-swing.

[ 01-11-2002: Message edited by: MadridMan ]

Toddy - Your comments/observations/'hear-say' present an interesting and very logical step if correct. Suppose time will tell. Let's hear some insights from our Spanish friends on the board ....

I am very excited to know (in credence to my sources) that Spain and the United States future is so inter-twined. This past weekend I was also told that Italy is building an entrance into the future expansion of NAFTA. HOWEVER, Spain and, next, the UK are still the main players in NAFTA's future expansion (according to my sources).
If any country deseves a little economic glory its Spain de verdad.
I'm sure the crui(z)ses will be happy!

Toddy,

Make sure you stay around us on this message board. This info "access" is great - we can all enjoy a little "operative" info, that's for sure!

Thanks again...and keep us posted.

Guys, I really don't see Spain in a NAFTA agreement. Though I don't discard it, that would mean a 180 degree change in our forgein policy.

Spain is a very compromised country with the EU. The government (this one and the past ones too) have the policy of being the joint point between the European Union, Spanish America and the Magreb. We have historicly had good relationships with all these areas, and geographicly we are something of a "neutral point". I really don't see Spain breaking this relations in order to become a NAFTA country.

If this information is true, we spaniards should congratulate, but what I would expect is becoming part of NAFTA without breking the rest of the links. Thus, Spain would be the bridge between all this worlds (EU, NAFTA, Magreb and Lathynamerica).

Fernando

Anyone care to comment on how the euro tranistion is going...hopefully, well. Are the coins accepted in most vending machines? Are pesetas still being used? Are most all cash transactions only in euro now?

Faster than expected. I don't have any pesetas by now (only notes and because I haven't gone to the bank to change them). Besides, it has been time since I saw pesetas coins for the last time.

Vending machines already accept euros.

I would say 90-95% of the transactions (at least in Madrid) are done in euros by now.

Regards.

Fernando

Hello.

There's a little problem. It seems that the banks haven't enough amount of coins. I've a couple of friends working in banks and they have problems when they must give coins to the owners of shops, restaurants, etc.

And I've heard it also from a friend of mine that owns a pharmacy and to the owner of the restaurant where I eat everyday.

I'm not ecomomist and so, I don't know if what I'm going to say is real or is just a rumour... I've heard that they are waiting to bring out all the coins to avoid a rise in the inflation. ¿ ?

I read in the newspaper that the Spaniards had sold tons of Euro coins to France since there was a shortage of French cents coins in the country. Now I wonder why?

I cannot understand what difference it makes but the French authorities were quite embarrassed about being compelled to use the Spanish coins instead of "their own". Wasn´t it supposed to be a common currency

Hello.

The notes ¿tickets? of 5, 10, 20 ... Euros are the same in all Europe but, the coins are different. In Spain, the picture that appears in 1 and 2 euros coins is the face of the king Juan Carlos, in the coins of 10, 20 and 50 cents is the face of Cervantes and in the coins of 1, 2 and 5 cents is Santiago de Compostela Cathedral.

Bye.

Yes, that´s how it is, hombre_g, but I think you missed my point(s):

To start with why to sell Spanish coins to France if you don´t have enough of them yourself?

And for the second, now that the currency is common why is it so embarrassing for the French to use the Spanish coins?

Saludos,Tia

Hey Tía!

Our goverment gave our coins to France because our president is a crawler and a (BUTT)licker (MM edited) :p and because our President and his assistant did a bad forecast of the number of coins that we were going to need.

If we had enough coins I wouldn't mind if we give loads of them to France but, now in France they don't have problems with the amount of coins and we have scarcity of coins. I'm sure that the France goverment thinks that we are a bit stupid (or almost that our goverment the P.P. is a bit stupid)

And ... they don't like our coins because they are chauvinist .

All the same, not all the french are chauvinist. I know a lot of them and they don't care if their money has our king face or not. They just spend their coins in Spain filling the gas tank of their cars very cheap and buying wine, beer and whisky in our shops and bars.

[ 02-07-2002: Message edited by: MadridMan ]

Uhm, I've heard another story about France getting Spanish euros. It seemed that they were not able to produce all the coins and notes they need and they asked the Spanish Fábrica Nacional de Moneda y Timbre to produce some for them. Obviously, we only produce euros with the Spanish designs here.

If this is true, then I understand they may feel embarrased to confess they didn't have the capacity to produce so many coins and notes.

As for Spain giving euro coins when we are short of them, I don't think that's true. At the begining, there were complains about a shortage of coins. But the problem wasn't a lack of coins but problems with deliveries. In fact, many shops complaint banks didn't give them euro coins/notes so that they were forced to take credit cards instead of cash and so got charged commission by the banks.

However, it's been more than a month since the euro was introduced and I don't heard of such problems now. Maybe it is happening in some cases but at least not with the hostels and the shops where I buy.