I remember from my only other (too short) trip to Madrid that in my hotel and other little shops there were many brochures for group motorcoach kind of tours. I'm guessing they would be something like daytrips from London to Stonehenge, Bath, etc. that I've taken. Has anyone ever tried any of these? Or is it better or cheaper to do it on your own by train or regular bus?

[ 09-06-2001: Message edited by: MadridMan ]

Ramsey, Welcome to the board. I've done the Toledo trip four times: by car, train and bus. I've always done the trip solo (without the use of a tour company), so even though I've nothing to compare it to, I prefer this, and think you will get the most interesting trip by doing it alone.

Toledo is like a labyrinth, and therein lies the adventure. Most tour groups will take you to the Alcazar, the Cathedral and the Church of San Tomé to see El Greco's painting. These are all worthy stops, but you can find those on your own, wind up and down streets that allow you to reach out and touch the buildings on both sides, and really "breathe in the ambience". I suggest also a walk up from the train station, through the Bisagra gate, and don't miss the Iglesia del Cristo de la Luz. Pay the gardener there a few hundred pesetas, and you can run around in there looking at things for as long as you'd like.

There are other posts on this site re: Toledo. Just do a search and get the opinions of others to sift through as well.

I just got back and did a daytrip to Toledo. I did it by bus with a friend and had a great time. Not that hard at all to do, and I was glad I didn't do it with a tour group. That's definitely not necessary and could actually be a negative.
I'm going to be posting everything about my trip over the next few days so there will be more about Toledo shortly.
Adam

How long time does it take to get there?
How much does it cost?
How long time is required to explore?
What's the latest time for transport back to Madrid?
What's the unmissable sights in Toledo?


[ 09-05-2001: Message edited by: Ria ]

How long?
From Atocha train station (the closest to the city center) an hour.

How much?
1.485 pts round trip

How long to explore?
2 days the sites.
4 days to know the city by heart.
a month to know the history.

Latest time?
It may depend on the day you choose, check out www.renfe.es
(renfe is the Spanish official train company, there is only one)

Unmissable sights?
Forget about them for the first day, have
a whisky and go back a thousand years in time. Get lost in Toledo, let your mind and
fantasy free. Enjoy.

André

[ 09-06-2001: Message edited by: MadridMan ]

André,

Two days the sites? There is a lot to see and enjoy, but remember the old part of tyhe city is really small, and everything is close. I would say 6/9 hours, depending of the time you have, better 9, not to hurry.

Ignacio

Ramsey,

My personal preference would be by car if I already planned on having one. That way I could include a stop at Chinchon, and Aranjuez. That would make a great two day trip out of the city.

If Toledo is all you're interested in, I would suggest spending a little over a day there. I'd go by train. Arrive a little after noon, spend the night at the Paradores if you feel comfortable about the cost, then spend the following morning there, and head back to Madrid by train about mid-afternoon.

I also agree with those who said you should explore Toledo on your own. There are nifty tourist maps available for a couple of dollars that will help you navigate through the city on foot. There's so much to see that you may need to budget your time based on the hours that the places you want to see are open to the public. That's why I suggest an overnight arrangement. It allows you to catch more of what you want during specified hours, and the train schedules are more complete during the normal hours of business.

Wolf

I could spend a half day just in Toledo's magnificent Cathedral, marvelling at the art & architecture. Then, of course one must see el Greco's Conde de Orgaz painting in the San Tomé church, a pass thru c/Levi, a stop for mazapan & coffee and you still haven't seen todo Toledo (so I bought a Videotape).
When I was younger, the sword factory and the damascene work were what I went to see but now it is the 'square,' the Alcazar and the Parador (and the 'vista' from the other side of the rio Tagus).

If you can't afford the Parador, try the Maria Cristina near the Plaza de Toros. For one's only visit to Toledo, I would recommend an overnight stop and a day and a half.
P.D.
If you go by bus, don't miss the Mozarabe train station. It's a beautiful building.

I've been to Toledo twice, once staying overnight and the second time just going by bus for the day (primarily because we didn't have enought time to stay overnight again - which would have been preferable!). I'd gladly go again - we still haven't seen everything (eg. the Alcazar, the museum just off of the plaza mayor, etc....) and it is a wonderful "just wander around" town even if you've seen all the "sites".

I've heard the train is preferable (and the station beautiful) but for some reason of scheduling we went by bus both times. It takes about an hour, there are frequent buses (every hour I think) and was quite cheap, the only inconvenience being getting to the new bus station (Estacion Sur, I think is the name) in Madrid. As for motorcoach tours, I just remember my first time in Toledo, spending hours in the cathedral, and seeing all the tour groups being rushed through - thinking "Poor sods, they're probably driving back to Madrid in an hour to get pushed through El Prado this afternoon!!"

You should go to everything Eddie mentioned!!! And if you have time try to go to at least one of the two synagogues and the monastery (amazing cloister). All three are within a few blocks on the side of the town farthest from the cathedral - on city maps they are on the left! Come to think of it, they aren't too far from San Tome and the astonishing Conde de Orgaz. Sorry I can't think of the names - don't have a Toledo guidebook here at work with me!

The only suggestion of Eddie's I disagree with is "a stop for mazapan & coffee." "A stop"??? No, No, at least two, maybe three stops for that mazapan!!! And one stop to buy a box to take home with you!



[ 09-07-2001: Message edited by: Brian Goldthorp ]